"Tree and Leaf" by JRR Tolkien

[Columcille]

At one time it was a dominant view that all such matter was derived from "nature-myths." The Olympians were personifications of the sun, of dawn, of night, and so on and all the stories told about them were originally myths (allegories would have been a better word) of the greater elemental changes and processes of nature. Epic, heroic legend, saga, then localized these stories in real pleaces and humanized them by attributing them to ancestral heroes, mightier legends, dwindling down, became folk-tales, Marchen, fairy-stories--nursery-tales. (JRR Tolkien The Tolkien Reader. "Tree and Leaf." Ballantine books. New York. 1966. p.49.)

There are a few quotes from this book that I would like to use to open a discussion. ActRaiser has started one on RPG (Role-Playing-Games) and I think it necessary to discuss one element that makes up the RPG, namely fantasy. I personally do not see the element of chance in the game a big problem... who doesn't play solitaire or ever played Yatzee, Monopoly, or other board games based on the role of a dice? If not, I would not be surprised if such people are in the same catagory as the Amish, not to diminish their good values, or the most legalistic of denominations.

As far as Christian's concern for D&D or other RPG scenerios as a gateway to witchcraft, I certainly would not rule it out or even deny it that it happens. But in and of itself, the game is harmless. It is more of an abuse to use the game in such a fashion to introduce people to the occult; to turn the fantasy into the real.

The reason I quoted JRR Tolkien in my introductory quote is a matter of examining fantasy. The idea of a subcreation, the use of our imagination, are things which attest to God as the great designer. How we got myth, not myth as a falsehood, is that we try to make meaning and sense of the world around us. In this regards, we see motifs that are similiar in every culture. Lewis became a Christian based on this observation. The dying god motif as it applied to Christ was the myth that became reality.
I think that many people that are most fascinated with witchcraft and the occult is based on their desire to control their lives, where there was no control before. I also believe that the influence of paganism attributes this control to understanding the elements of nature rather than understanding nature's origins as coming from God. This is, of course, a broad generalization. People involved in witchcraft probably have a diverse range of beliefs from paganism to agnosticism, to New Age to who knows what. The fact that witchcraft takes place and speads across a large range of worldviews should attest to the fact that none of idea of each subgroup that uses it is right about its true nature. As such, the attributing by Christians seems most accurate that it is not from God.

[TRiG]

I enjoyed Tree & Leaf, but I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. Probably because I should have been in bed a couple of hours ago.

TRiG.

[Columcille]

Originally Posted by TRiG

I enjoyed Tree & Leaf, but I'm not sure what point you're trying to make here. Probably because I should have been in bed a couple of hours ago.

TRiG.

There are some Christians who would deny their children from reading "Harry Potter" books. The same criticism of D&D and other role-playing games seems to be the same in regards to reading fantasy books. The introducing "Tree & Leaf" is therefore an interesting essay by JRR Tolkien. Since fantasy books by C.S. Lewis has a lot of religious symbology, i.e. Aslan is a lion... Lion of Judah is Christ, Christians accept his work as appropriate. Coincidently, JRR Tolkien is also favored reading and there is not as much religous symbolism except accidentally within his Middle Earth mythology and story telling. Because he was an Inkling, right along with Lewis and Charles Williams, and probably knew of Dorothy L. Sayers, he pretty much gets a free pass. I always hear about how Gandalf is a type of Christ, and in a sense he displays Christ like qualities, but Christ is God and Gandalf is one of the Istari and his original name is Olorin given to him in his youth at Valinor. As such, for Tolkien, Gandalf is not Christ as, for Lewis, Aslan is Christ--which is best demonstrated in Aslan's sacrifice in "The Lion, the Witch, and the Wardrobe."