mormon salvation = 'saved' from WHAT?

[Christian]

Physical death? Nope. . .mormons die.

Resurrection to judgement? Nope. MOST FOLKS GET JUDGED TO GO TO HELL. THAT IS NOT Biblical 'being saved' from anything.

The TRUTH is that the REAL JESUS CHRIST (not the mormon demon 'jesus') died for our sins, NOT to get us 'resurrected to judgement.' JESUS CHRIST paid the penalty for our sins. THAT is what we are REALLY 'saved from.' The penalty for sin is death. Jesus took that upon HIMSELF for us.

The mormons seem to be confused.

Do you suppose it is that near-relative of their 'jesus,' his 'spirit-brother' satan who wants them to be confused?

[Erundur]

Mormons believe that the atonement of Jesus Christ 1) saves us from physical death (this is called resurrection, and 2) saves us from sin if we exercise faith in Christ, repent, are baptized, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and endure to the end.

[Christian]

Mormons believe that the atonement of Jesus Christ 1) saves us from physical death (this is called resurrection, and 2) saves us from sin if we exercise faith in Christ, repent, are baptized, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and endure to the end.

And yet ALL MORMONS suffer physical death, and God NEVER required the mormon junk (or YOURSELF) to save yourself from the penalty of your sins. HE only requires FAITH

[Erundur]

And yet ALL MORMONS suffer physical death
So do ALL PROTESTANTS. Does that mean they're not saved?


and God NEVER required the mormon junk
If I could show you all five items I listed in the Bible, would you believe them?

[Erundur]

HE only requires FAITH
So since Mormons have faith, we must be saved, right?

[Christian]

You can have faith in dog if you wish. It may even get you a bone! If it is a BIG dog it might even protect you from being bitten by a little dog.

Likewise, faith in a 'jesus' that is a demon's 'spirit-brother' won't save you from Hell either.

[Erundur]

You can have faith in dog if you wish.
We have faith in Jesus Christ. Is that good enough for you?

[Christian]

Originally Posted by Christian http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173284#post173284)
You can have faith in dog if you wish.


We have faith in Jesus Christ. Is that good enough for you?

Sadly you don't even realize that your 'jesus christ' is the same 'jesus christ' the muslims, white supremecists, oneness pentecostals and other cults have faith in, and NOT the REAL Jesus Christ described in the Bible.

I continue to pray for you.

[Christian]

erunder posted:



Originally Posted by Christian http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173275#post173275)

And yet ALL MORMONS suffer physical death


So do ALL PROTESTANTS. Does that mean they're not saved?

No, but it DOES MEAN that Biblical Salvation is NOT 'saving' you from physical death as you claimed.


and God NEVER required the mormon junk

If I could show you all five items I listed in the Bible, would you believe them?

I believe EVERY WORD OF THE BIBLE. It is your 'private interpretations' of joe smith's that I don't believe.

SHOW ME where ANY CHRISTIANS IN THE ORIGINAL CHURCH (the one joey smith is supposed to have 'restored') ever believed ACCORDING TO THE BIBLE

WHERE did those original CHRISTIANS ever believe in

Christian temples?
being baptized for those who had died?
that you could become a god?
that the REAL GOD was ever an 'exalted man?'
any 'jesus christ' that was a 'spirit baby' of 'heavenly father' as a 'spiritual brother' of satan who was supposedly another 'spirit baby' of 'heavenly father?'

Sorry erunder, but your mormon religion falls flat just like the other 150 or so 'lds' religions do. Yours is no more real than theirs are. And YOU HAVE NO EVIDENCE OTHERWISE.

[Erundur]

Sadly you don't even realize that your 'jesus christ' is the same 'jesus christ' the muslims, white supremecists, oneness pentecostals and other cults have faith in, and NOT the REAL Jesus Christ described in the Bible.
As monotheists, we believe there is only one Jesus Christ, so your statement is nonsensical to us.

[Erundur]

No, but it DOES MEAN that Biblical Salvation is NOT 'saving' you from physical death as you claimed.
So your claim is that the Bible denies the resurrection?


I believe EVERY WORD OF THE BIBLE.
And yet you don't believe the five items I listed even though they're all Biblical.

[alanmolstad]

As monotheists, .....

Mormons are about as far from being monotheist as you can get!.......LOL

Mono = one , single, lone.


The Bible teaches that while there are tons and tons of things that people can "call" god, there actually is only one God by nature, the rest are all fake.

So the way I define being a mono(one) theist is that you must believe there is only one God.....
You cant dodge around the issue by saying, "We only believe there is one God to worship" if you then also believe there are other gods.

The moment you believe there are other gods you are in the world of the CULTS !

The world of the CULTS has many different ways to sneak in their false teachings...one such false teaching is that there are many Gods and that people can become a god too.

The moment I hear such talk I just smile........

You can call yourself a god all you want....I dont give a rip....You will never be one so it's pointless to claim to be one...
But whatever floats your boat I guess....

[Erundur]

Mormons are about as far from being monotheist as you can get!.......LOL
And yet I'm the one ***erting one Jesus Christ, while "Christian" is ***erting multiple Jesus Christs.


So the way I define being a mono(one) theist is that you must believe there is only one God.....
Would that be the Father, Son, or Holy Ghost?

[alanmolstad]

the truth is that guys like Smith and Sun Myung Moon are well known for saying, that they teach about "Jesus" , but the truth is that they teach an invented understanding of our Lord.

Smith and Moon teach a false Jesus....a fake Jesus...

Thus the truth is that while there is only one true Jesus, there are lots and lots of "false Christs (as the Bible warned us about) and yet because Smith and Moon have a clever spiel, they trick their followers into believing in their false Christ.




So what happens to the People like the Mormons or the Moonies when they die and go to judgement?

They come face to face with the very hard fact that you can dpo all kinds of works in the name of a fasle Christ and not have any relationship with the true Lord Jesus at all...


and thus Mormons and Moonies die in sin, unforgiven and unrepentant ........so totally blinded by a con man's story that they had no clue that the very people they were debating all the time were the very same people sent to be their light out of the darkness....

[alanmolstad]

Would that be the Father, Son, or Holy Ghost?



Not "or", but "and"....The one God of the Bible is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

[Erundur]

Smith and Moon teach a false Jesus....a fake Jesus...
Why do you think Jesus Christ is a fake?

[Erundur]

Not "or", but "and"....The one God of the Bible is Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
And that's who Mormons believe in. So is that monotheism or polytheism?

[alanmolstad]

Why do you think Jesus Christ is a fake?

The Mormon Jesus is fake because Smith invented it...he lied...
he never saw any angels...
he never dug up any stuff....

It was a con ***.

He was a conman.

His *** was to fool people, thats what this guy did to earn money, evcen way before he came out with his tall-tale about seeing things .

..You already know this to be true.


He was consumed in his lust for younger and younger girls....
He used his position over others in his church to get girls to sleep with him...

He even used to send husbands out of town and then 'drop by" to score with the guy's wife.

You already know this as well....
Im not saying anything you have not already known to be true.

Smith invented these teachings about Jesus that are different than what the Bible and the Christian church teach.

But if this is so, Why do Mormons believe him?
The idea of learning a hidden truth, or a new teaching is very attractive to many people, and they wanted to get in on the hidden truths that Smith was telling people he knew...and that is why CULTS like the Mormon church grow, for it appeals to that darker side of our human nature.


Smith's Jesus is a "fake Jesus" because it is invented by Smith to be different, and thus It runs counter to the Bible's revelation.




thats why the Mormon Jesus is fake.

[alanmolstad]

And that's who Mormons believe in. So is that monotheism or polytheism?

If a person holds that there are other gods...they are not "mono" theistic ....

It dont matter squat that they worship only one, or two or just a handful out of millions...

It dont matter.......





It dont matter for they have left the teachings of the Bible and have followed some other guy's dreamed-up inventions.



Smith dreamed it up....
Smith dreamed up all kinds of stories to fool people. That is how he earned money during his life before he started pushing the religious stuff.
Smith used to claim to be able to do some type of magic trick, (Like look at a stone in a hat) and convince people that if they paid him a fee he would be able to find buried treasure on their land....


Is anyone truly shocked to learn that later in his life he would then claim to have found a hidden secret book?



Is anyone truly shocked that a guy known to try to score with lots and lots of girls, might send a few husbands out of town so as to get them out of the way?




Is anyone truly shocked that a guy who was able to convince husbands and fathers into turning a blind eye to his bed-hoping would then later claim to be doing greater works than Jesus?...

or to claim himself to be a god?


No, none of us should be shocked to learn about all this stuff Smith got into, because that is the kind of monster we know he was...

[Erundur]

The Mormon Jesus is fake because Smith invented it...
You think Jesus Christ was invented by Joseph Smith? We disagree with you.


He was consumed in his lust for younger and younger girls....
He used his position over others in his church to get girls to sleep with him...
I think you're projecting.

[Erundur]

If a person holds that there are other gods...they are not "mono" theistic ....
So if someone believes in the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost they are not monotheistic, is that right?

[alanmolstad]

You think Jesus Christ was invented by Joseph Smith? .
Mormon teachings on the person of Jesus were invented by a conman named Smith to fool people, gain power over them, and get money, as well as the ability to sleep with their wives and at times, their daughters.

You already know all Im saying is the truth.





There is a real Jesus that is unknown to the Mormon religion....

It's unknown because the real Jesus was replaced in the hearts of the Mormon member with a false concept of our Lord......and when the Mormon believes in this false Jesus he is still in sin, and is unforgiven....

[alanmolstad]

So if someone believes in the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost they are not monotheistic, is that right?



If a person holds to the idea that there is more than one God, (The names of these other gods is of no concern to me) then by my definition that person is not monotheistic.


It's that simple...



It does not matter squat if the person later tried to hide behind the idea that while they understand there are many other gods, they only worship one of them.
If a person actually holds to the idea that there are other gods, they are not monotheistic case-closed.





All that Im saying is already known to you.

Now we had a Mormon here that always tried to be clever and use clever wordings to twist things around, and if I were talking to him on this subject Im sure he would now at this point post something like - "But Alan you believe in the Father is God, the Son is God, and the Spirit is God, so you must believe in 3 gods then ?"


Like I said, we 'had' a person like that around here.....He didn't last long it seems.

I got nothing against people who want to ask me questions or who want to talk about their own religion, that is what this place is all about.
But I just dont got the time needed to deal with people that regardless of what is said simply try to twist words in clever ways, all the while fleeing the truth that they already know confronts them.

[Erundur]

Mormon teachings on the person of Jesus were invented by a conman named Smith to fool people, gain power over them, and get money, as well as the ability to sleep with their wives and at times, their daughters.
Easy to claim; harder to prove. Anyway, I think you're just projecting a Protestant mindset onto Joseph.


You already know all Im saying is the truth.
I know what you're saying is false.

[Erundur]

If a person holds to the idea that there is more than one God, (The names of these other gods is of no concern to me) then by my definition that person is not monotheistic.
Mormons say the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God. So are we monotheistic or polytheistic?

[Christian]

Mormons say the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God. So are we monotheistic or polytheistic?

Mormons ALSO SAY that you can BECOME A GOD just as mormons ALSO SAY that others have become gods too.

THAT MAKES MORMONS POLYTHEISTIC.

[Christian]

erunder posted:


Originally Posted by Christian View Post
No, but it DOES MEAN that Biblical Salvation is NOT 'saving' you from physical death as you claimed.


So your claim is that the Bible denies the resurrection?

You are being INTENTIONALLY IGNORANT. No, I am pointing out to you that SALVATION is NOT 'saving you from physical death. YOU WILL PHYSICALLY DIE, just like everyone else.

SALVATION REMAINS reference to the FORGIVENESS OF SINS, paid for by JESUS CHRIST (the REAL ONE) on the cross, nearly 2,000 years ago.


I believe EVERY WORD OF THE BIBLE.

And yet you don't believe the five items I listed even though they're all Biblical.

Yet YOU don't seem to have any 'five items' listed that I can find.
Please list them again. . .IF THE BIBLE SAYS IT IN CONTEXT I WILL BELIEVE EVERY WORD OF IT. But of course almost always you throw verses out there OUT OF CONTEXT of what the Bible ACTUALLY SAYS.

So REPOST your '5 items' and we will look at them.

In the meantime, please stop playing the 'intentionally ignorant' game. It is not a game worthy of an adult imho

[Christian]

Originally Posted by Christian http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173290#post173290)
Sadly you don't even realize that your 'jesus christ' is the same 'jesus christ' the muslims, white supremecists, oneness pentecostals and other cults have faith in, and NOT the REAL Jesus Christ described in the Bible.


As monotheists, we believe there is only one Jesus Christ, so your statement is nonsensical to us.

So you disagree with JESUS CHRIST (THE REAL ONE) Who told us:

Matt 24:23-25
23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
NKJV

IF you would look up the p***age to CHECK THE CONTEXT you would find that JESUS said it.

So you don't believe HIM.

We knew that. . .

Of course you are 'monotheists in name only.' Your religion teaches you that men can be 'exalted' and BECOME GODS. How do YOU reconcile the existance of ONLY ONE GOD ANYWHERE (THE BIBLICAL GOD) with those men YOUR CULT SAYS BECAME GODS that do/don't exist?

OY! Such a CONFUSED CULT!

[Christian]

And yet I'm the one ***erting one Jesus Christ, while "Christian" is ***erting multiple Jesus Christs.


Would that be the Father, Son, or Holy Ghost?

JESUS (THE REAL ONE not your satanic one) said:

Matt 24:23-25
23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
NKJV

It would appear that your FALSE PROPHET told you that there are no false christs. YOUR CULT HAS LIED TO YOU. . .again

[Christian]

erunder posted:


Originally Posted byalanmolstadhttp://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png
(http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173304#post173304)Mormon teachings on the person of Jesus were invented by a conman named Smith to fool people, gain power over them, and get money, as well as the ability to sleep with their wives and at times, their daughters.

Easy to claim; harder to prove. Anyway, I think you're just projecting a Protestant mindset onto Joseph.

I know what you're saying is false.

Said with head buried in sand. . .

[Erundur]

Mormons ALSO SAY that you can BECOME A GOD just as mormons ALSO SAY that others have become gods too.

THAT MAKES MORMONS POLYTHEISTIC.

Okay, so someone who believes in gods other than God is polytheistic. Would that include the gods of Psalm 82?

[Erundur]

You are being INTENTIONALLY IGNORANT.
False. I am asking follow-up questions based on your ignorant statements.


No, I am pointing out to you that SALVATION is NOT 'saving you from physical death.
And I am pointing out that you're wrong. Salvation from physical death = resurrection. And resurrection is Biblical.


Yet YOU don't seem to have any 'five items' listed that I can find.
The are right there in post #2. We are saved from spiritual death if we exercise faith in Christ, repent, are baptized, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and endure to the end.

[Erundur]

So you disagree with JESUS CHRIST (THE REAL ONE) Who told us:

Matt 24:23-25
23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
NKJV

Of course not. I disagree with you that Jesus Christ is one of these false christs.

[Erundur]

JESUS (THE REAL ONE not your satanic one) said:
We don't have a satanic Jesus. We disagree with you that Jesus Christ is satanic.

[alanmolstad]

Mormons say the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God. So are we monotheistic or polytheistic?

If a person believes in more than one god, then they are NOT monotheistic.....


so ask yourself, "Do the Mormons hold to the teaching that there are many gods?"
If you believe the answer is "yes" then that means they are polytheistic.


"Do the Mormons hold to the teaching that humans can become gods?"
If you believe the answer is "yes" then that means they are polytheistic.



It's that simple...

[alanmolstad]

Okay, so someone who believes in gods other than God is polytheistic. Would that include the gods of Psalm 82?

Yes, if a person believes that there is more than one God, that means they are polytheistic.

That is also why Psalm 82 is not talking about Gods by nature, but is as I said before, a ***le given to things that have great power over others.
In the case of Psalm 82 we are simply talking about judges that are judging in error.....

In effect, God is mocking them.


So Psalm 82 can not be used to support the Mormon idea that there are many Gods.





Got anything else?

[Erundur]

Yes, if a person believes that there is more than one God, that means they are polytheistic.
Okay, so if someone believes the Bible, they are polytheistic.


That is also why Psalm 82 is not talking about Gods by nature, but is as I said before, a ***le given to things that have great power over others.
Psalm 82 doesn't say that, and there's no exception in the definition of "polytheist" for gods who aren't gods by nature.

[alanmolstad]

if you note, the psalm 82 starts out talking about the "great ***embly", and this is a known reference to the type of ruling system in place at the time.

The text then goes on to talk about the main issue the was going wrong with these guys, when they would show - " partiality to the wicked".

The text then goes on to encourage the same men to - "Defend the weak and the fatherless;
uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed.
4
Rescue the weak and the needy;
deliver them from the hand of the wicked."....so we are in fact talking about the rulers in charge at the time who were doing what was evil in the sight of the Lord, and who were being instructed to do good.

Finally the fate of these men is shown at - "“I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’
7
But you will die like mere mortals;
you will fall like every other ruler."

Notice they will die just like every other "ruler"




The text clearly teaches that these were just the rulers in power at the time....and God is mocking them and their claims of being important.





I believe that this verses is talked about during the debate on the doorstep with a Mormon that is performed by Mr Ed Decker and Dr Walter Martin.

Im not totally sure, but I seem to remember that recording is where Martin talks about what this verse is talking about, and if I have time I will try to review the recording and post it here so that you and anyone else interested in understanding this section of the Bible can listen to it and get up to speed.

[alanmolstad]

if you note, the psalm 82 starts out talking about the "great ***embly", and this is a known reference to the type of ruling system in place at the time.

The text then goes on to talk about the main issue the was going wrong with these guys, when they would show - " partiality to the wicked".

The text then goes on to encourage the same men to - "Defend the weak and the fatherless;
uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed.
4
Rescue the weak and the needy;
deliver them from the hand of the wicked."....so we are in fact talking about the rulers in charge at the time who were doing what was evil in the sight of the Lord, and who were being instructed to do good.

Finally the fate of these men is shown at - "“I said, ‘You are “gods”;
you are all sons of the Most High.’
7
But you will die like mere mortals;
you will fall like every other ruler."

Notice they will die just like every other "ruler"




The text clearly teaches that these were just the rulers in power at the time....and God is mocking them and their claims of being important.





I believe that this verses is talked about during the debate on the doorstep with a Mormon that is performed by Mr Ed Decker and Dr Walter Martin.

Im not totally sure, but I seem to remember that recording is where Martin talks about what this verse is talking about, and if I have time I will try to review the recording and post it here so that you and anyone else interested in understanding this section of the Bible can listen to it and get up to speed.

[alanmolstad]

Also check The Kingdom of the Cults page 219, Im told its relevant,,,,

[alanmolstad]

Also check The Kingdom of the Cults page 219

Due to the late hr I have not had a chance yet to review the Ed Decker/Walter martin debate to find where they deal with the Psalm verse, but I was doing a web-search and I found lots of stuff on this verse that I will be posting about later...

Like - https://thewordonthewordoffaithinfoblog.com/2010/03/24/what-does-the-bible-mean-by-%e2%80%9cyou-are-gods%e2%80%9d-ye-are-gods-in-psalm-826-and-john-1034/


The fun part to see is justr how closely my own wordings were to the works i have seen so far...LOL-

"Psalm 82:1 says, “God presides in the great ***embly; he gives judgment among the gods.” It is clear from the next three verses that the word “gods” refers to magistrates, judges, and other people who hold positions of authority and rule."

[alanmolstad]

But to just sum up -

There are many things and people that can be called 'god', in the context that they have great power over others.
In the Bible some judges are called a god because they have such a powerfull control over people, power of life and death as it were.

But they are not gods by nature, they are always human and will always be human...LOL

Thus you can't use the Psalm 82 verse to support the crazy idea that there is more than one God ...

[Christian]

We don't have a satanic Jesus. We disagree with you that Jesus Christ is satanic.

Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' to your 'jesus christ,' isn't that correct?

Doesn't that make the 'brother' of a demon, one of the same kind? Playing some 'magical' word games are you?

[Christian]

Of course not. I disagree with you that Jesus Christ is one of these false christs.

And still, the 'jesus christ' you are talking about that you disagree about, is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' of the demon satan, right? If they are 'brothers,' are they NOT from the same 'blood line' and of the same type of being? Demons?

Your cult STILL lies to you.

[Erundur]

Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' to your 'jesus christ,' isn't that correct?
No, it isn't.

[Erundur]

And still, the 'jesus christ' you are talking about that you disagree about, is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' of the demon satan, right? If they are 'brothers,' are they NOT from the same 'blood line' and of the same type of being? Demons?
No, they're not.

[alanmolstad]

No, it isn't.

Even in the silly attempt of the Mormon church to duck around this teaching, they yet admit it's true...

According to Mormon teaching, Satan and Jesus Christ are brothers...


http://mormonvoices.org/1/jesus-brother-of-satan

[alanmolstad]

Oh and for the record, according to Christian teaching, Jesus Christ is NOT the brother of Satan!

[Christian]

Originally Posted by Christian View Post
And still, the 'jesus christ' you are talking about that you disagree about, is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' of the demon satan, right? If they are 'brothers,' are they NOT from the same 'blood line' and of the same type of being? Demons?

No, they're not.

No they are not from the same 'heavenly father?'
or
No they are not the same type of being. . .'spirit brothers?'

Sorry but you cannot have it both ways. . .one a demon, the other a god.

And your cult's self-contradiction shows it is a fraud.

Your cult STILL lies to you.

[Christian]

Originally Posted by Christian View Post
Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' to your 'jesus christ,' isn't that correct?

No, it isn't.
Okay, I got distracted by a telephone call from The Navy in Arlington VA and worded it incorrectly

Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother to your 'satan,' NOW isn't that correct?

Or did your religion lie to you yet again?

And you continue to play little nit-picky word-games. YOU KNEW what I meant despite my typo, but you ran away from addressing it.

[Christian]

Originally Posted by Christian View Post
So you disagree with JESUS CHRIST (THE REAL ONE) Who told us:

Matt 24:23-25
23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
NKJV

Of course not. I disagree with you that Jesus Christ is one of these false christs.

Yet you CLAIMED that only ONE Jesus Christ existed. You don't mind contradicting yourself, do you?

[Erundur]

No they are not from the same 'heavenly father?'
or
No they are not the same type of being. . .'spirit brothers?'
No they are not from the same blood line (spirits don't have blood) and no they are not the same type of being.


Sorry but you cannot have it both ways. . .one a demon, the other a god.
Of course we can.

[Erundur]

Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother to your 'satan,' NOW isn't that correct?
Yep, and all of us, too.


And you continue to play little nit-picky word-games. YOU KNEW what I meant despite my typo, but you ran away from addressing it.
I answered the question you asked because I know anti-Mormons get very upset if we answer the question you should have asked.

[Erundur]

Yet you CLAIMED that only ONE Jesus Christ existed.
Yep, in contrast to your claim that multiple Jesus Christs exist (polytheism).


You don't mind contradicting yourself, do you?
If it ever happens, I guess we'll find out.

[alanmolstad]

The phrase "anti-mormon" is not allowed on this message board. ...please make note of this when posting. ....thanks

[Christian]

Erunder posted:




Originally Posted by Christian http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173334#post173334)
Yet you CLAIMED that only ONE Jesus Christ existed.

Yep, in contrast to your claim that multiple Jesus Christs exist (polytheism).

Mormonism (by YOUR daffynishun) is a fake. After all over 150 MORMON CULTS (utah, temple lot, fundamentalist lds etc groups) exist.

I guess YOU must 'believe in them ALL!' or do you pretend they do not exist?



You don't mind contradicting yourself, do you?

If it ever happens, I guess we'll find out.

It happens here on this board DAILY. You just have a brainwashed mind.

[Christian]

No they are not from the same blood line (spirits don't have blood) and no they are not the same type of being.

So your 'heavenly father' impregnates his goddesses with BOTH DEMONS AND GODS? How does he decide? "This sperm today, that different one tomorrow?" HOW STUPID IS THAT?

[QUOTE]Sorry but you cannot have it both ways. . .one a demon, the other a god.

Of course we can.

So your good/bad 'heavenly father' supposedly 'fathers' demons and gods? Reproducing after his own kind Is satan your 'heavenly father's' kind?'

[Christian]

Yep, and all of us, too.


I answered the question you asked because I know anti-Mormons get very upset if we answer the question you should have asked.

You anti-Christians don't like to obey the rules do you? "anti-mormons' is not allowed here.

You KNEW that but you continue to violate the rule with your lie anyway.

That tells a LOT about your cultic religion's honesty. . .

[Christian]

erunder posted:


Originally Posted by Christian http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173309#post173309)
You are being INTENTIONALLY IGNORANT.


False. I am asking follow-up questions based on your ignorant statements.

In YOUR IGNORANCE you claimed salvation meant being saved from PHYSICAL DEATH. I pointed out the fact that you MORMONS DIE just as often as anyone else does.

Nothing 'ignorant' about my response at all

No, I am pointing out to you that SALVATION is NOT 'saving you from physical death.

And I am pointing out that you're wrong. Salvation from physical death = resurrection. And resurrection is Biblical.

So is PHYSICAL DEATH.

Heb 9:27-28
And as it is appointed for men to die once, but after this the judgment,
NKJV

You must REDEFINE 'salvation' to pretend it means 'from physical death.' You still get judged and condemned to hell. :(


The are right there in post #2. We are saved from spiritual death if we exercise faith in Christ, repent, are baptized, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and endure to the end.[/QUOTE]

Not Biblical at all. We don't (on our own) 'exercise faith. We repent and are Baptized because we have FAITH and have RECEIVED the Gift of the Holy Ghost, and then GOD enables us to endure to the end.

THAT is Biblical.

[Erundur]

It happens here on this board DAILY.
Then provide three examples of me contradicting myself.

[Erundur]

So your 'heavenly father' impregnates his goddesses with BOTH DEMONS AND GODS? How does he decide? "This sperm today, that different one tomorrow?" HOW STUPID IS THAT?
What? You think that whether one is a god or a demon is determined by sperm? That is pretty stupid.

[Erundur]

In YOUR IGNORANCE you claimed salvation meant being saved from PHYSICAL DEATH.
CFR! Let's see what I actually said.


Not Biblical at all.
Of course they are. Typical anti-Christian tactic: deny, deny, deny, even when the statement is indisputably true.


We don't (on our own) 'exercise faith.
Notice how you had to alter my statement so you could deny Biblical doctrine.

[Christian]

CFR! Let's see what I actually said.


Of course they are. Typical anti-Christian tactic: deny, deny, deny, even when the statement is indisputably true.


Notice how you had to alter my statement so you could deny Biblical doctrine.

I DO notice that in your ignorance you have quoted NOTHING Biblical at all, but you have given only your own OPINIONS about the Bible.

"indisputably true?" WHAT A JOKE! Since WHEN are your OPINIONS about Biblical doctrine 'indisputable' in ANY WAY AT ALL?

ATTACK THE MESSENGER. You do that when you cannot PRODUCE substantive content.

[Christian]

Originally Posted by Christian http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png (http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/showthread.php?p=173343#post173343)
It happens here on this board DAILY.

Then provide three examples of me contradicting myself.

Let's see now. .. .You PRETEND I believe those false christs and/or false prophets. . .I don't. . .you do.

You PRETEND the other 149+ mormon religions are not really 'mormon' religions. . .I don't. . .you do

You PRETEND that salvation is being 'saved' from physical death, yet mormons die every day.

Now it is YOUR turn. . .PROVE that John 3:16 is a lie and that the God of Heaven (not sparkle glory) begat zillions of 'spirit sons...'

PROVE that the 149+ (want me to republish the list here?) are not really 'mormon religions.

PROVE that being resurrected to ****ation = 'salvation.'

Of course you cannot.

[Erundur]

I DO notice that in your ignorance you have quoted NOTHING Biblical at all, but you have given only your own OPINIONS about the Bible.

"indisputably true?" WHAT A JOKE! Since WHEN are your OPINIONS about Biblical doctrine 'indisputable' in ANY WAY AT ALL?
It is not my opinion that faith, repentance, baptism, gift of the Holy Ghost, and enduring to the end at Biblical. It's an objective fact.


ATTACK THE MESSENGER. You do that when you cannot PRODUCE substantive content.
Speaking of not producing substantive content, the CFR is not satisfied.

[Erundur]

Let's see now. .. .You PRETEND I believe those false christs and/or false prophets. . .I don't. . .you do.

You PRETEND the other 149+ mormon religions are not really 'mormon' religions. . .I don't. . .you do

You PRETEND that salvation is being 'saved' from physical death, yet mormons die every day.
I don't think you know what "contradict" means. Let me help you out:

Definition of contradict
transitive verb

1: to ***ert the contrary of : take issue with •contradict a rumor •She contradicted her brother's account of what happened.
2: to imply the opposite or a denial of •Your actions contradict your words. •The evidence contradicts his testimony.

https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/contradict

So if I were to contradict myself, I would ***ert one thing, then later ***ert the opposite. Provide examples of me doing that.


Now it is YOUR turn. . .PROVE that John 3:16 is a lie and that the God of Heaven (not sparkle glory) begat zillions of 'spirit sons...'

PROVE that the 149+ (want me to republish the list here?) are not really 'mormon religions.

PROVE that being resurrected to ****ation = 'salvation.'
It's not my *** to prove your beliefs; it's yours.


Of course you cannot.
That's because your beliefs are false.

[Christian]

[QUOTE]PROVE that John 3:16 is a lie and that the God of Heaven (not sparkle glory) begat zillions of 'spirit sons...'

PROVE that the 149+ (want me to republish the list here?) are not really 'mormon religions.

PROVE that being resurrected to ****ation = 'salvation.'
[QUOTE]

Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe in 'heavenly father god' begetting all sorts of 'spirit babies,' it is up to YOU to support that belief, not me.

Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe that the 'other' mormon religions are fake mormon religions, it is up to YOU to support that belief as well, not me.

Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe that resurrected to ****ation = 'Biblical salvation, it is up to YOU to support YOUR belief there as well, not me.

It is not up to ME to support YOUR beliefs.

What's the matter? You can't do it? You aren't UP TO IT?

THAT FIGURES!

[Christian]

What? You think that whether one is a god or a demon is determined by sperm? That is pretty stupid.

I'm not the one who claims that YOUR supposed 'heavenly father' impregnates his goddesses with 'spirit babies.' YOUR CULT tells you that.

HOW DO YOU SUPPOSE your goddesses know which to produce, a satanic demon or a godlet "spirit baby"

IF NOT BY 'spiritual sperm?'

We are discussing YOUR CULT'S teaching about imaginary 'spirit babies'. WE CHRISTIANS DON'T BELIEVE ANY OF it.

So who's looking stupid now?

[Erundur]

Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe in 'heavenly father god' begetting all sorts of 'spirit babies,'
That is a lie.


Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe that the 'other' mormon religions are fake mormon religions,
That is a lie.


Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe that resurrected to ****ation = 'Biblical salvation,
That is a lie.


It is not up to ME to support YOUR beliefs.
No one has asked you to, but I do expect you to support your beliefs. Are you up to it?

[Erundur]

I'm not the one who claims that YOUR supposed 'heavenly father' impregnates his goddesses with 'spirit babies.'
Yeah, actually you are. You're the only one claiming that.


HOW DO YOU SUPPOSE your goddesses know which to produce, a satanic demon or a godlet "spirit baby"
I don't, of course. This is your belief, not mine.


IF NOT BY 'spiritual sperm?'
I would love to see your support for spiritual sperm in the Bible.


So who's looking stupid now?
Are you sure you want me to answer that? ;)

[alanmolstad]

Yeah, actually you are. You're the only one claiming that.


I don't, of course. This is your belief, not mine.


I would love to see your support for spiritual sperm in the Bible.


Are you sure you want me to answer that? ;)

you finding the board is not updating like it should?

We had that issue for a long time back a year////

[alanmolstad]

That is a lie.


That is a lie.


That is a lie.


No one has asked you to, but I do expect you to support your beliefs. Are you up to it?

Dont refer to the comments of others as a "lie" please.......

[Erundur]

you finding the board is not updating like it should?

We had that issue for a long time back a year////
Sometime it tells me my post won't appear until it is approved by a moderator. Not every time, though.

[Christian]

erunder posted:


Originally Posted by Christian View Post
Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe in 'heavenly father god' begetting all sorts of 'spirit babies,'


That is a lie.

WHICH is a lie? That you believe what your church teaches? Or is it that your church TEACHES a god who 'begets' all those 'spirit babies?' WHICH DO YOU THINK is a lie?

That is a lie.


Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe that the 'other' mormon religions are fake mormon religions,

WHICH DO YOU THINK is a lie? That you believe what your church teaches? Or is it that your church TEACHES that the other 'lds religions' are false religions? Fakes.



Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe that resurrected to ****ation = 'Biblical salvation,

That is a lie.

WHICH DO YOU THINK is a lie? That you believe it?

YOU DID CLAIM that salvation = being saved from physical death = resurrection did you not?

How do YOU explain what happens to your 'sons of perdition' who are 'resurrected to ****ation?


It is not up to ME to support YOUR beliefs.


No one has asked you to, but I do expect you to support your beliefs. Are you up to it?[/QUOTE]

I have NO PROBLEM supporting MY beliefs (which are totally BIBLICAL in their origins) but that would be against the rules of this forum as I understand it. This is the place where we address MORMON teachings, NOT CHRISTIAN teachings.

Besides it is YOU who espouse the above MORMON DUNG, not me. I don't espouse ANY of it.

Are YOU UP TO SUPPORTING YOUR POSITIONS?

[alanmolstad]

Sometime it tells me my post won't appear until it is approved by a moderator. Not every time, though.

That is a common issue...it has nothing to do with me or anything about your posts.
And it does it to even me at times...

[Erundur]

WHICH is a lie?
Your statements. Did you forget what you typed already?


YOU DID CLAIM that salvation = being saved from physical death = resurrection did you not?
I did not.


I have NO PROBLEM supporting MY beliefs (which are totally BIBLICAL in their origins) but that would be against the rules of this forum as I understand it.
That's convenient. But if you make a claim on this board and refuse to support it when challenged, I'll have no choice but to accept your concession.

[Erundur]

That is a common issue...it has nothing to do with me or anything about your posts.
And it does it to even me at times...
Not a big deal. As long as I remember to copy my reply to the clipboard before I post it I can work around the problem.

[Christian]

erunder posted:


Originally Posted by Christian View Post
Since it is YOU, NOT I who believe in 'heavenly father god' begetting all sorts of 'spirit babies,'

Your statements. Did you forget what you typed already?

Nope. I cut and pasted much of it for YOU. You STILL plead ignorance. . .

You claim to believe all of these abhorrent doctrines that your religion claims, but like any five-year-old refuse to discuss Biblically or rationally.

Trying to reason with you is like trying to reason with a pig. Put lipstick on it and it's still a pig.

Your religion CLAIMS that your 'heavenly father was once a man, became 'exalted' into being a god, but was always the same god from eternity to teternity, NEVER changing. . .a contradiction by your cult.

Your religion CLAIMS it follows the BIBLICAL Jesus Christ while it follows a 'jesus christ' that your religion CLAIMS is a spirit-brother of satan. Since the BIBLE says Jesus Christ is the ONLY Son EVER fathered by the God of the Bible, that makes YOUR 'jesus christ' into a false christ (which YOU claim doesn't exist).

Sorry, but you sound like an irrational, brainwashed child to me.

At some point I am supposed to stop casting pearls before swine (I would ***ume that would even mean those wearing lipstick. . .).

So I will likely stop posting with you.

in the Name of the REAL Jesus Christ,
Morefish

[Erundur]

You claim to believe all of these abhorrent doctrines that your religion claims
False. My religion does not claim a "'heavenly father god' begetting all sorts of 'spirit babies,'" and I have never claimed to believe it. You're the only one here teaching it.


Trying to reason with you is like trying to reason with a pig. Put lipstick on it and it's still a pig.
That makes no sense. If you're going to insult me, at least make your insults coherent.


Sorry, but you sound like an irrational, brainwashed child to me.
This phenomenon is known as projection.


So I will likely stop posting with you.
Good idea, then you can talk to all the other Mormons who post here. Oh wait...

[Christian]

[QUOTE=Erundur;173381]False. My religion does not claim a "'heavenly father god' begetting all sorts of 'spirit babies,'" and I have never claimed to believe it. You're the only one here teaching it.

You are NOT Mormon? The lds religion teaches that its god is the 'father of spirits' who 'fathers' (that is what the word 'begets' MEANS) spirit babies who come to earth to get human bodies.

Is that NOT what your religion teaches?

What religion ARE YOU then? "fundamentalist?" 'reorganized?' 'temple lot lds?' WHAT?

And WHAT is your religion's 'good news' or 'gospel'? That you get to be judged for your sins and sent to hell for them? THAT's supposed to be 'GOOD' news? Naaah. . .

[Erundur]

You are NOT Mormon? The lds religion teaches that its god is the 'father of spirits' who 'fathers' (that is what the word 'begets' MEANS) spirit babies who come to earth to get human bodies.
No it doesn't; you just made that up.


Is that NOT what your religion teaches?
It is not. If it was, you'd be able to cite that teaching and prove me wrong. But you can't.

[alanmolstad]

The only men who become Gods, even the Sons of God, are those who enter into polygamy.

Others attain unto a glory and may even be permitted to come into the presence of the Father and the Son; but they cannot reign as kings in glory, because they had blessings offered unto them, and they refused to accept them."

[alanmolstad]

"Marriage to only one woman is only *partial compliance* to the law of exaltation."

[alanmolstad]

'To deny or refuse the Prophet when he does reinstate polygamy would be tantamount to denying Christ in person "

[alanmolstad]

http://www.christianpost.com/news/what-do-mormons-believe-ex-mormon-speaks-out-part-two-58494/




"If I had any advice for a Christian who wanted to witness to a Mormon it would be to know your Bible!

Don't worry so much about what Mormons believe – know what you believe!

[alanmolstad]

"
Sex in Heaven?

Next to be studied is Mormonism's at***ude towards Jesus and His relationship to people in general. Brigham Young professed, "WE BELIEVE THAT JESUS CHRIST IS OUR ELDER BROTHER ...." Likewise, Joseph Smith said, "Among the spirit children of Elohim [God the Father], the firstborn was and is ... Jesus Christ to whom all others are juniors" (Ludlow, p.280).

LDS apostle Bruce McConkie writes, "Implicit in the Christian verity that all men are the spirit children of an Eternal Father is the usually unspoken truth that they are also the offspring of AN ETERNAL MOTHER" (quoted in Tanners, p.164).

Moreover, another Mormon apostle, Orson Pratt, declared, "We have now clearly shown that GOD THE FATHER HAD A PLURALITY OF WIVES, one or more being in eternity, by whom He begat our spirits as well as the spirit of Jesus His first born, AND ANOTHER BEING UPON THE EARTH BY WHOM HE BEGAT THE TABERNACLE [PHYSICAL BODY] OF JESUS, as His only begotten in this world" (quoted in Tanners, p.227).

Joseph Smith explains further, "Jesus Christ is the Son of Elohim both as spiritual and bodily offspring; that is to say, ELOHIM IS LITERALLY THE FATHER OF THE SPIRIT OF JESUS CHRIST AND ALSO OF THE BODY in which Jesus Christ performed His mission in the flesh ..." (Ludlow, p.280).

Putting this all together, Mormonism teaches the SPIRITS of all people were conceived in heaven via physical, sexual intercourse between the Father and one or more of his goddess wives. This "heavenly sex" is possible since the Mormon god (and presumably His wives) have "all the parts and p***ions" that we do.

Thus, in Mormonism, the only difference between Jesus and people in general is that His spirit was conceived before ours. Also, to produce Jesus' physical body, the Mormon god came down to earth and had sexual intercourse with the virgin Mary.



http://www.dtl.org/cults/article/mormonism.htm

[alanmolstad]

http://www.utlm.org/onlineresources/ldsleadersbelievepolygamyinheaven.htm

[alanmolstad]

Each God, through his wife or wives, raises up a numerous family of sons and daughters; indeed, there will be no end to the increase of his own children: for each father and mother will be in a condition to multiply forever and ever.”

[alanmolstad]

“Will I know my mother as my mother when I get over on the Other Side?”…”Certainly you will,” was the instant reply of the Prophet. “More than that, you will meet and become acquainted with your eternal Mother, the wife of your Father in Heaven.”…”And have I then a Mother in Heaven?” exclaimed the astonished girl…”You ***uredly have. How could a Father claim His ***le unless there were also a Mother to share that parenthood?””

[alanmolstad]

Logic and reason would certainly suggest that if we have a Father in Heaven, we have a Mother in Heaven. That doctrine rests well with me. However, in light of the instruction we have received from the Lord Himself, I regard it as inappropriate for anyone in the Church to pray to our Mother in Heaven…The fact that we do not pray to our Mother in Heaven in no way belittles or denigrates her…none of us can add to or diminish the glory of whom we have no revealed knowledge”

[alanmolstad]

http://www.exmormon.org/mormon/mormon385.htm

[Christian]

So erunder doesn't believe in a heavenly father who impregnates his wife with spirit children in a preexistance?

Does erunder consider himself to be a mormon?

[Erundur]

So erunder doesn't believe in a heavenly father who impregnates his wife with spirit children in a preexistance?
No, he doesn't.


Does erunder consider himself to be a mormon?
Yes, he does.

[alanmolstad]

...... a heavenly father who impregnates his wife with spirit children in a preexistence?




Yes, this wacky teaching is at the real core of why guys hang in there and stay Mormon, even if they understand that Smith made it all up.

The sex....

Endless sex in heaven is part of the thinking that many Mormon men always have in the back of their minds...
Even if they actually reject many of Smith's ideas as 'crazy" it is yet this idea that if Smith was right about the sexual encounters he and other Mormon men could have in heaven, then it's worth sticking in the Mormon church.

When I was younger I worked on a farm that had a bunch of Mormon guys also working there, and I can tell you for a fact that they do talk....they do spend time thinking about the many girls that they each would claim as wife in heaven....
Many of the Mormon guys would talk about the other girls in town, (like many of their wives' friends, or their co-workers) that they have secretly dreamed about being married to in heaven.

So the idea that their Mormon God in heaven has sexual encounters with his wives is believed.....mostly because it's also the dream of Mormon men too!

[dberrie2000]

Yes, this wacky teaching...

It might be wacky--but that is the same way we impregnate our wives and repopulate the earth here.

Alan--that isn't man's way--it's God's way. There is not one organ on your body which man devised.

[Christian]

And yet I'm the one ***erting one Jesus Christ, while "Christian" is ***erting multiple Jesus Christs.


So the way I define being a mono(one) theist is that you must believe there is only one God.....

Would that be the Father, Son, or Holy Ghost?

The correct word is 'and,' not 'or.'

And Since you don't know God. . .you will go to the same place as sun myung moon, william butler, and joe smith have gone. :(

Following false christs as they all did will get you straight to hell.

[Erundur]

Following false christs as they all did will get you straight to hell.
We disagree with you that Jesus Christ is a false christ, so I'm not worried.

[Christian]

We disagree with you that Jesus Christ is a false christ, so I'm not worried.

You CLAIM that your mormon'jesus christ' is the same as my BIBLICAL Jesus Christ, BUT YOU KNOW BETTER. You are just to afraid to admit it. . .

Following joe smith's 'spirit-brother-of-satan 'christ' will simply lead you to hell.

[Erundur]

You CLAIM that your mormon'jesus christ' is the same as my BIBLICAL Jesus Christ, BUT YOU KNOW BETTER. You are just to afraid to admit it. . .
False. You're going to have to come up with an actual argument if you want to convince me that Jesus Christ is false.

[alanmolstad]

False. You're going to have to come up with an actual argument if you want to convince me that Jesus Christ is false.

"What is the difference between the Mormon Jesus and the Jesus of the Bible? " http://www.equip.org/perspectives/what-is-the-difference-between-the-mormon-jesus-and-the-jesus-of-the-bible/


Mormons can claim to believe in Jesus all they want, but it’s apparent from their teachings that the Jesus they profess is definitely not the Jesus of the Bible. The truth is they worship another Jesus, proclaim another gospel, and teach the skin of the truth stuffed with a lie. Ultimately, all cults and world religions, in one way or another, compromise the deity of the Lord Jesus Christ

[alanmolstad]

Simply believing in someone named Jesus will not solve the issue for Mormons because — as the apostle Paul warns in 2 Corinthians 11:4 — there are some who preach a different Jesus. For example, while the Bible teaches that Jesus has always existed as God (John 1:1), Mormons see Jesus as someone who worked His way up to godhood. In fact, to Mormons, Jesus is merely one in purpose with God the Father; whereas the Bible declares that the Father and the Son are also one in essence (cf. Phil. 2:6) — that they are both equally God and members of the Holy Trinity.

http://www.equip.org/perspectives/what-is-the-difference-between-the-mormon-jesus-and-the-jesus-of-the-bible/

[alanmolstad]

This leads me to what is perhaps the most problematic matter facing Mormons with regard to their view of Christ. You see, in their attempt to evade charges of polytheism — which, of course, is the belief in or worship of more than one god — Mormons end up prohibiting prayer to Jesus. Mormons confess that they believe in the existence of many gods but pray only to God the Father. Well, in light of the Bible’s explicit command to pray to Jehovah (cf. Deut. 4:7; 2 Chron. 7:14; Pss. 5:2; 32:6; Jer. 29:7, 12), it’s simply incredible that Mormons refuse to pray to Jesus while yet acknowledging Him to be Jehovah! In addition, let me point you to p***ages like John 14:14 and Romans 10:12 which demonstrate beyond the shadow of a doubt that believers ought to pray to Jesus.

http://www.equip.org/perspectives/what-is-the-difference-between-the-mormon-jesus-and-the-jesus-of-the-bible/

[alanmolstad]

Hinckley says that Mormons believe in a different Jesus.
https://carm.org/hinckley-says-mormons-believe-different-jesus

[alanmolstad]

In Mormonism, Jesus is a creation, the product of relations between god and his goddess wife who used to be people from another world (McConkie, Bruce, Mormon Doctrine, p. 192, 321, 516, 589). Jesus is the literal spirit brother of the devil and you and I (McConkie, p. 192, 589). Also, in Mormon theology, God has a body of flesh and bones (Doctrine & Covenants 130:22) as does his wife, and together they produce spirit offspring in heaven who inhabit human bodies on earth.

https://carm.org/hinckley-says-mormons-believe-different-jesus

[alanmolstad]

Mormon Jesus


The literal son of god and his goddess wife begotten in the pre-existence.
The brother of all spirits born in heaven in the premortal existence.
One of 3 gods in the godhead.
The Trinity is three separate gods.
First one to receive a spirit body.
Atoned for sin on the cross and in the garden of Gethsemane.





Christian Jesus


Not the literal son of god and his goddess wife.
Not the brother of all spirits born in heaven in a premortal existence.
Not one of 3 gods in the godhead.
The Trinity is 3 persons in one God.
Was always spirit from eternity.
Atoned for sin on the cross alone.

[alanmolstad]

“As a church we have critics, many of them. They say we do not believe in the traditional Christ of Christianity. There is some substance to what they say” (Gordon Hinckley, “We look to Christ,” Ensign (Conference Edition), May 2002, p. 90).

[alanmolstad]

“And virtually all the millions of apostate Christendom have abased themselves before the mythical throne of a mythical Christ whom they vainly suppose to be a spirit essence who is incorporeal uncreated, immaterial and three-in-one with the Father and Holy Spirit” (Bruce R. McConkie, Mormon Doctrine, 1966, pg.269).

[alanmolstad]

“It is true that many of the Christian churches worship a different Jesus Christ than is worshipped by the Mormons or The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints” (Bernard P. Brockbank, “The Living Christ,” Ensign (Conference Edition), May 1977, p. 26).

[alanmolstad]

“Christ worked out his own salvation by worshiping the Father. After the Firstborn of the Father, while yet a spirit being, had gained power and intelligence that made him like unto God; after he had become, under the Father, the Creator of worlds without number; after he had reigned on the throne of eternal power as the Lord Omnipotent-after all this he yet had to gain a mortal and then an immortal body” (Sermons and Writings of Bruce R. McConkie, 1966, p. 61).

[alanmolstad]

“Jesus became a God and reached His great state of understanding through consistent effort and continuous obedience to all the Gospel truths and universal laws” (Milton R. Hunter, The Gospel Through the Ages, p. 51).

[alanmolstad]

“That Jesus attained eternal perfection following his resurrection is confirmed in the Book of Mormon. It records the visit of the resurrected Lord to the people of ancient America. There he repeated the important injunction previously cited but with one very significant addition. He said, ‘I would that ye should be perfect even as I, or your Father who is in heaven is perfect.’ This time he listed himself along with his Father as a perfected personage. Previously he had not” (Russell M. Nelson, “Perfection Pending,” Ensign (Conference Edition), November 1995, p. 87).

[alanmolstad]

“The appointment of Jesus to be the Savior of the world was contested by one of the other sons of God. He was called Lucifer, son of the morning. Haughty, ambitious, and covetous of power and glory, this spirit-brother of Jesus desperately tried to become the Savior of mankind” (Milton R. Hunter, The Gospel Through the Ages, p. 15).

[alanmolstad]

“Jesus was the firstborn spirit child of God the Father and thus the recipient of the birthright of the royal family. As such, and in that premortal realm, he was the Elder Brother of all of the spirit sons and daughters of the Father” (BYU Professor Robert L. Millet, A Different Jesus? The Christ of the Latter-day Saints, p. 20).

[alanmolstad]

“Christians speak often of the blood of Christ and its cleansing power. Much that is believed and taught on this subject, however, is such utter nonsense and so palpably false that to believe it is to lose one’s salvation. Many go so far, for instance, as to pretend, at least, to believe that if we confess Christ with our lips and avow that we accept him as our personal Savior, we are thereby saved. His blood, without other act than mere belief, they say, makes us clean” (LDS Tract ***led What the Mormons Think of Christ, p. 31).

[alanmolstad]

So yes, the Mormon Jesus is a False Christ......its fake!

The difference is clear to anyone reading this that the Mormons teach false ideas about Christ that are not supported by the Bible.

[Erundur]

"What is the difference between the Mormon Jesus and the Jesus of the Bible? "
There is no difference. There is only one Jesus Christ.


http://www.equip.org/perspectives/what-is-the-difference-between-the-mormon-jesus-and-the-jesus-of-the-bible/
Our beliefs are not dictated by anti-Mormon websites.

[Christian]

erunder posted:

There is no difference. There is only one Jesus Christ.

FALSE according to Jesus:

Matt 24:24-25
For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
NKJV


Our beliefs are not dictated by anti-Mormon websites.

No, they are dictated by false 'prophets' instead.

joey smith was your earliest false prophet. He claimed that HIS 'jesus' was a 'spirit brother' to satan.

Since when did satan have a spirit?

[Erundur]

FALSE according to Jesus:
False. Jesus never said there was more than one of him. He said there would be false christs, not multiple Jesus Christs.


No, they are dictated by false 'prophets' instead.

joey smith was your earliest false prophet. He claimed that HIS 'jesus' was a 'spirit brother' to satan.
Worthless anti-Mormon hate-rhetoric.


Since when did satan have a spirit?
Since his spirit was created. He is a spirit without a physical body.

[alanmolstad]

Please review the rules concerning the use of "Derogatory Terms"

[alanmolstad]

You want proof that the Mormon teachings about Jesus are wrong?....

In Mormonism, Jesus is a creation, the product of relations between god and his goddess wife who used to be people from another world (McConkie, Bruce, Mormon Doctrine, p. 192, 321, 516, 589).





There you go!

The Mormon teachings are clearly different than the teachings of the Bible.

[alanmolstad]

“As a church we have critics, many of them. They say we do not believe in the traditional Christ of Christianity. There is some substance to what they say”


(Gordon Hinckley, “We look to Christ,” Ensign (Conference Edition), May 2002, p. 90).




There we see the Mormons admitting that they do not believe in the same Christ as is believed in Christianity!

[alanmolstad]

To prove that the Mormon teachings of salvation are different than the Bible's teachings, all you have to do is read what the mormons say to see how different it really is!




“Christians speak often of the blood of Christ and its cleansing power. Much that is believed and taught on this subject, however, is such utter nonsense and so palpably false that to believe it is to lose one’s salvation. Many go so far, for instance, as to pretend, at least, to believe that if we confess Christ with our lips and avow that we accept him as our personal Savior, we are thereby saved. His blood, without other act than mere belief, they say, makes us clean[/I]”

(LDS Tract ***led What the Mormons Think of Christ, p. 31)





There, in the quote above we see proven that the Mormon salvation is totally against what the bible teaches!