Does the Bible teach that there are many gods (polytheism)

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Originally Posted by Billyray

Actually I have answered this question several times. But I am more than happy to answer this one again for you. God is God over everything including idols and unrighteous judges.

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And why do you think that in Psalms 82, it also says 'and children of the Most High"---do you then see these unrighteous judges as children of the Most High?

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Originally Posted by BigJulie

And why do you think that in Psalms 82, it also says 'and children of the Most High"---do you then see these unrighteous judges as children of the Most High?

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Yes it says that these unrighteous judges are "sons of the Most High Nevertheless you will die like men, And fall like any one of the princes. Arise, O God, judge the earth!"

So far you have given me unrighteous judges and false idols as "gods"and that this is the basis thus far for the Bible supporting polytheism. Are there any other gods that you would like to add?

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Originally Posted by Billyray

Yes it says that these unrighteous judges are "sons of the Most High Nevertheless you will die like men, And fall like any one of the princes. Arise, O God, judge the earth!"

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So, you see unrighteous judges as "children" of the most high. How do you reconcile that?

You also gave an example of the ESV that states that these are possibly Gentiles. Do you disagree with the ESV on this one?

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So far you have given me unrighteous judges and false idols as "gods"and that this is the basis thus far for the Bible supporting polytheism. Are there any other gods that you would like to add?

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Actually, that is the answers you keep giving. Are you ignoring my Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, etc. answer. Wow, Billyray, are you reading my answers or not?

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Originally Posted by BigJulie

So, you see unrighteous judges as "children" of the most high. How do you reconcile that?

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How I reconcile it is that these are unrighteous judges who are referred to as "gods" and "children of the most high". ESV Study Bible "82:1–4 The Task of the “Gods.” The first section gives the *** description of human rulers (the gods), especially those who rule God's covenant people:they are to give justice to the weak and the fatherless, and rescue the weak and the needy*. *. *. from the hand of the wicked (vv. 3–4). Far too often, however, they judge unjustly and show partiality to the wicked (i. e., people who take the lead in opposing God's purpose and oppressing others)."

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Originally Posted by BigJulie

Are you ignoring my Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, etc. answer. Wow, Billyray, are you reading my answers or not?

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Which post did you say that Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob are gods? Perhaps I missed that one so either link it or give me the post number.

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Originally Posted by Billyray

Which post did you say that Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob are gods? Perhaps I missed that one so either link it or give me the post number.

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Post #4--I said that this is whom God calls gods...leaders whom He foreordained to be rulers.

I guess "Christian" gods are idols and gentile leaders and unrighteous judges. Wow--did not know that.

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Originally Posted by BigJulie

Post #4--I said that this is whom God calls gods...leaders whom He foreordained to be rulers.

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BigJ's list of gods taught in the Bible
1. Unrighteous judges in Psalm 82
2. Abraham
3. Isaac
4. Jacob
5. 12 apostles


Any other "gods" to add to this list?

Can you give me the verses in the Bible that you are using to substantiate that Abraham, Isaac, Jacob, and the 12 apostles are "gods"?

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Originally Posted by BigJulie

I guess "Christian" gods are idols and gentile leaders and unrighteous judges. Wow--did not know that.

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Perhaps you forgot that Christians are monotheistic not polytheistic like the mormons.

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Originally Posted by BigJulie

Post #4--I said that this is whom God calls gods...leaders whom He foreordained to be rulers.

I guess "Christian" gods are idols and gentile leaders and unrighteous judges. Wow--did not know that.

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Yes Julie the leaders and judges of the people are called elohim.. So were the idols of the peoples of the land.. The Church agrees with The Lord (YHWH) that He is our Elohim.. We (the Church) look for a God other than the one true God as being our Lord.. Unless you deny the deity of Jesus and the Holy Spirit you would be in agreement with Joseph Smith that you have three Gods, not with Jesus who confirmed that the Lord our God is one Lord (Mark 12:29)..

You have come a little way in understanding that the kind of elohim men can be is to be a judge over the people.. Still these are never Gods like Jesus is God.. They all have died like men.. Why? because they are MEN.. The meaning of Psalm 82 must agree with Isaiah 43:10.. One can't supersede the other. Since Isaiah is so pragmatic the only way to make Psalm 82 God's truth agree without abandoning is to understabd that elohims are any person in authority, or any idol that is worshiped falsely by men.. Christians don't deny these facts we accept them for how they are taught not just is one p***age of the Bible but in the whole of scripture.. IHS jim

No one can get around Isaiah 43. God's word cannot be avoided, ignored, nor refuted. When God speaks he doesn't change his mind, and since he is not a man, he cannot lie.

10 Ye are my witnesses, saith the Lord, and my servant whom I have chosen: that ye may know and believe me, and understand that I am he: before me there was no God formed, neither shall there be after me. 11 I, even I, am the Lord; and beside me there is no saviour. 12 I have declared, and have saved, and I have shewed, when there was no strange god among you: therefore ye are my witnesses, saith the Lord, that I am God. 13 Yea, before the day was I am he; and there is none that can deliver out of my hand: I will work, and who shall let it?

Gary

Yes...that's a powerful set of verses.

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Originally Posted by Libby

Yes...that's a powerful set of verses.

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Indeed Libby, and just those two verses totally blast LDS claims of multiple gods period.

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Originally Posted by Gary_Biblelover

Indeed Libby, and just those two verses totally blast LDS claims of multiple gods period.

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You would think so! I remember Isaiah 44:6...

"Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God"

hitting me like a ton of bricks.

But, the LDS apologists have, supposed, "answers" for everything...

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Originally Posted by Libby

You would think so! I remember Isaiah 44:6...

"Thus saith the LORD the King of Israel, and his redeemer the LORD of hosts; I am the first, and I am the last; and beside me there is no God"

hitting me like a ton of bricks.

But, the LDS apologists have, supposed, "answers" for everything...

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Uh-huh. Even when they make no sense. I like something I heard Dr. Martin say on a video. He said that no one with a good working knowledge of the Bible could ever be in a cult. Oh almost forgot Libby, how about the references to "God our savior" or savior God? wow that speaks volumes in those few words, eh?

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Originally Posted by Gary_Biblelover

Uh-huh. Even when they make no sense. I like something I heard Dr. Martin say on a video. He said that no one with a good working knowledge of the Bible could ever be in a cult. Oh almost forgot Libby, how about the references to "God our savior" or savior God? wow that speaks volumes in those few words, eh?

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Like Libby, said, LDSinc. Has answers for everything,

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Originally Posted by Gary_Biblelover

Indeed Libby, and just those two verses totally blast LDS claims of multiple gods period.

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Only on the most superficial, and therefore incorrect, level. To real Bible scholars, who have done real research into the history of Israel's theology, it's your theory that gets blasted out of the water. Totally. Do you you need some help locating such research?

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Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

Like Libby, said, LDSinc. Has answers for everything,

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And unlike ANTI-LDS, Inc., the answers are CORRECT. :)

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Originally Posted by BigJulie

And why do you think that in Psalms 82, it also says 'and children of the Most High"---do you then see these unrighteous judges as children of the Most High?

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Since when do real gods die as men?

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Originally Posted by Phoenix

And unlike ANTI-LDS, Inc., the answers are CORRECT. :)

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Papa? You know in your heart they are not.

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Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

Like Libby, said, LDSinc. Has answers for everything,

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Yup, I guess even wrong answers are better than no answers to them :)

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Originally Posted by Phoenix

Only on the most superficial, and therefore incorrect, level. To real Bible scholars, who have done real research into the history of Israel's theology, it's your theory that gets blasted out of the water. Totally. Do you you need some help locating such research?

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Nope I think I have pretty much had it all expressed to me, thanks for asking. Until one understands who God is he cannot be saved. All I want is to help more people understand and I have another new thread I am about to start that might be of interest to you. (no spoilers tho ;) )

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Originally Posted by Apologette

Since when do real gods die as men?

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Yes, I was looking at those verses just this evening, because Richard brought them up in a conversation we were having and they really don't mean that we will become as God, Himself.

Psalms 5 They do not know nor do they understand; They walk about in darkness; All the foundations of the earth are shaken. 6 I said, "You are gods, And all of you are sons of the Most High. 7 "Nevertheless you will die like men And fall like any one of the princes."…

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Originally Posted by Apologette

Papa? You know in your heart they are not.

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He is not Papa. The Pheonix is Papa.

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Originally Posted by Libby

He is not Papa. The Pheonix is Papa.

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I believe that is correct. But I realize the similar screen names are confusing. Just a coincidence, as far as I know.

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Originally Posted by Phoenix

I believe that is correct. But I realize the similar screen names are confusing. Just a coincidence, as far as I know.

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Yes, it is a little confusing.