Is justification received on the basis of human merit?
Depends--are you referring to the justification of all men here--as a free gift?
Romans 5:18---King James Version (KJV)
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
IOW--through the Atonement--all men are justified to inherit eternal life--as an opportunity?
Or ---justified here--where man actually receives of His grace unto life?
James 2:20-26---King James Version (KJV)
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
2 John 9--King James Version (KJV)
9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
03-18-2017, 03:44 PM
dberrie2000
Depends--are you referring to the justification of all men here--as a free gift?
Romans 5:18---King James Version (KJV)
18 Therefore as by the offence of one judgment came upon all men to condemnation; even so by the righteousness of one the free gift came upon all men unto justification of life.
IOW--through the Atonement--all men are justified to inherit eternal life--as an opportunity?
Or ---justified here--where man actually receives of His grace unto life?
James 2:20-26---King James Version (KJV)
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
2 John 9--King James Version (KJV)
9 Whosoever transgresseth, and abideth not in the doctrine of Christ, hath not God. He that abideth in the doctrine of Christ, he hath both the Father and the Son.
Anyone?
03-18-2017, 03:48 PM
dberrie2000
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanmolstad
Is justification received on the basis of human merit?
In faith alone theology--salvation is independent of any works we do. Was Walter Martin of the faith alone theology? Or did he believe in obtaining salvation through a faith with works?
James 2:20-26--King James Version (KJV)
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
08-23-2017, 05:14 AM
alanmolstad
The answer is that there are actually 2 types of justification talked about in the Bible....one that is before other men, and the other that is only before God.
the Justification by works is before men.
men cant see into your heart so the only way we will know what you believe is in watching how you act, listening to what you say....looking at all you do, all your works.
But works dont save anyone, and that is why there is what the Bible called the "justification by faith.
The Justification by faith is before god.
Only God sees into your heart.
This is why we are only saved by Grace though FAITH, and not by works, because God is the only one that can save, and God is also the only one that can see your heart, your faith.
09-29-2017, 08:32 AM
dberrie2000
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanmolstad
The answer is that there are actually 2 types of justification talked about in the Bible....one that is before other men, and the other that is only before God.
the Justification by works is before men.
men cant see into your heart so the only way we will know what you believe is in watching how you act, listening to what you say....looking at all you do, all your works.
But works dont save anyone, and that is why there is what the Bible called the "justification by faith.
The Justification by faith is before god.
Could you relate to us if the reference to the term "faith"--found above--is a reference to a faith with works--or a faith without works?
James 2:20-26--King James Version (KJV)
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
09-30-2017, 05:22 AM
alanmolstad
Quote:
Originally Posted by dberrie2000
Could you relate to us if the reference to the term "faith"--found above--is a reference to a faith with works--or a faith without works?
James 2:20-26--King James Version (KJV)
20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?
21 Was not Abraham our father justified by works, when he had offered Isaac his son upon the altar?
22 Seest thou how faith wrought with his works, and by works was faith made perfect?
23 And the scripture was fulfilled which saith, Abraham believed God, and it was imputed unto him for righteousness: and he was called the Friend of God.
24 Ye see then how that by works a man is justified, and not by faith only.
25 Likewise also was not Rahab the harlot justified by works, when she had received the messengers, and had sent them out another way?
26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.
we are not saved by works...
We are saved by grace though faith, and thats all...nothing added to this.
Thus when we say "faith" we understand it to be never alone, for faith always has with it some works.
yet at the same time we are not saved by any works.
Understand this?
09-30-2017, 12:56 PM
dberrie2000
Quote:
Originally Posted by alanmolstad
Thus when we say "faith" we understand it to be never alone, for faith always has with it some works.
Please do identify what works faith has with it in obtaining salvation?
Alan--the faith alone preach obtaining salvation by grace through faith alone--excluding all works.
Sola fide---From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
"Sola fide (Latin: by faith alone), also known as justification by faith alone, is a Christian theological doctrine that distinguishes the Lutheran and Reformed branches of Protestant Christianity, as well as some other denominations, from the Catholic Church, the Eastern Orthodox Church, and some parts of the Restoration Movement, as well as the Methodist Churches, which affirm that following regeneration, good works are ordinarily necessary for salvation.
The doctrine of sola fide ***erts God's pardon for guilty sinners is granted to and received through faith alone, excluding all "works".
