Quote Originally Posted by tdidymas View Post
Michael, thank you for your reply to Hair, now I know how you judge me. So since you see me as weak and unlearned, then surely if you were led by the Spirit you would be making sure that I was well-instructed (which you have yet to do, since you have avoided answering a simple question from the beginning, and continue to do so). Please show me where my replies are unlearned:



When you quote 2 Peter 3:16, I ***ert you are misapplying it, since Peter was talking about predestination, justification, and such things being hard to understand, since the understanding of the truth of such matters depends on one's definition of basic concepts such as faith (which is ill-defined by many). In fact, your claim that tongues is hard to understand and unexplainable is where you err, as I quote from Paul in 1 Corinthians 12:28 "And God hath set some in the church, first apostles, secondarily prophets, thirdly teachers, after that miracles, then gifts of healings, helps, governments, diversities of tongues." So then to you, is this whole list unexplainable, or just tongues as you claim it? In fact, Paul is listing these things as elemental gifts in the church at the time, and does indeed well-explain the usage of them in that epistle, including tongues. Yet the usage of your gift you deem "not always explainable." In conclusion, I take it that your attempt at making some excuse (that it is unexplainable) puts your 'gift' in the category of cultic behavior, since you cannot explain it in terms of Biblical language. Do you leave me no other alternative than this conclusion?


Actually, my conversation is relatively friendly. If it appears vexing and callous, I think it is because of your unwillingness to fully confess your testimony of it, and perhaps this has fear behind it, namely fear of the unknown, since it is "not always explainable" to you. If you were completely honest in your answers, you would find my conversation friendly to you, although it might not necessarily be friendly to the practice you hold so dear.



I am being led by the Holy Spirit when I "try the spirits whether they are of God." I am being led of the Spirit when I use strict interpretation of the written Word. I am being led of the Spirit when I ask what the fruit of the action is. (Would you dare suggest to me that I am not being led of the Spirit in these things?)

Should I consider "trying" tongues as you suggest here? Should I try something that for all practical purposes may be something of a fleshly source (or worse, demonic)? Or even worse than this, should I "try" something that only the Holy Spirit gives, only to be found mocking the very Spirit who gives it? Should I "try" something that I see other people doing as if I was some infant who tries out his own babbling, just to be a part of adult conversation? The Bible clearly states that the Spirit gave utterance, therefore your suggestion that I consider "trying" it is conterfeit, to say the least, a bum steer. Then, everything you say from this point becomes more suspect.

Of course, it is about communion with the Creator. If God tells me to do this thing, I'll do it no matter what; but if you tell me I should do it, then why should I listen to you?



I did not reject this statement. In fact, I see it as the most honest thing you have said so far. What I objected to was the flowery and vague language that you wrote all around it. If you had said the single word "peace," you would have said (apparently) all that your honesty could muster, and that would have been enough. But your vague language all around it speaks volumes of pretentiousness.



Actually, I am simply trying to find out if indeed your practice is of God's Spirit, or has some other source. What I close entrance to is deception, since I've been there, done that before.

If this dialog appears mundane to you, then why don't you just end it?

Your 2 Tim. 4:13 ref doesn't appear relevant to this conversation.

Let me simply say at this point, you might as well be totally honest about your experience, rather than couching information in vague language or evasion. It would be better for us both if I reject your practice with full knowledge of your honest descriptions, rather than to reject it based on your refusal to confess it. Give me a reason to accept it!! By default I must reject it, unless you give me some positive Biblical evidence to accept it. Do you agree?
TD
We have not corrected anything here in my handling of this issue.

Of course, it is about communion with the Creator. If God tells me to do this thing, I'll do it no matter what; but if you tell me I should do it, then why should I listen to you?
Return and see what you have left behind on attaching doubt on all those statements Paul said concerning that which we should now begin to entrust:

“I do not want you to be unaware, , , I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God says, "Jesus is accursed"; and no one can say, "Jesus is Lord," except by the Holy Spirit.” (1 Corinthians 12:1,3)

Have I cursed our precious Lord? A double answer in a single question.

I did not reject this statement. In fact, I see it as the most honest thing you have said so far. What I objected to was the flowery and vague language that you wrote all around it. If you had said the single word "peace," you would have said (apparently) all that your honesty could muster, and that would have been enough. But your vague language all around it speaks volumes of pretentiousness.
Well thank you, but “most honest thing”? Here I am affirming the Kingdom of God (II Corinthians 1:20), and you invite others to view me as a false teacher?

If this dialog appears mundane to you, then why don't you just end it?
Let me ask you TDM, Did you really give ample room for an honest answer to that sentence? Once again, what is missing, is each of our loss of a sufficient answer we bring to the table. What happens is that answer becomes divided. One remains mundane (my experience in God), and the other, opening the door of possibilities to the gifts of the Spirit springs to life.

Your 2 Tim. 4:13 ref doesn't appear relevant to this conversation.
You, me and every Christian has I would hope their own record of being blessed in Him from day to day, from “glory to glory” (2 Corinthians 3:18). But as it is said a little later in that p***age: “Forgetting what is behind and straining toward what is ahead” (Philippians 3:13) We are all held harmless on this issue whether aggressive or not so aggressive. It is demonic when we begin to teach that what is said concerning these things are they themselves demonic. But the question remains, why should our reasoning remain on the bottom of the dead sea saying I disagree, which is under the same rhetorical spirit being perpetrated all the way from Egypt, where our Lord was crucified?

Give me a reason to accept it!!
Give you a reason? How about an impartial treatment of I Corinthians 12 and 14. If you find those chapters deceptive, I invite you to show me where.