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Thread: Because or for?

  1. #1
    dberrie2000
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    Default Because or for?

    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    Would this be an example of that--where God extends His salvational grace to them that obey Him?

    Acts 2:38King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon View Post
    Acts 10: 46 uses “for” where “because” could be used. Salvation comes before any works (See Ephesians 2:9)
    Could anyone here produce a translation that has "because" used in the Acts2:38 verse? IMO--this is another example of the faith alone attempt to alter or deny what the scriptures bear testimony to--God gives His salvational grace to them that obey Him. It defies faith alone theology--so an alteration is demanded--change it to because--instead of "for":


    New International Version
    Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    New Living Translation
    Peter replied, "Each of you must repent of your sins and turn to God, and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    English Standard Version
    And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    New American Standard Bible
    Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    King James Bible
    Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    Holman Christian Standard Bible
    Repent," Peter said to them, "and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    International Standard Version
    Peter answered them, "Every one of you must repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus the Messiah for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift.

    NET Bible
    Peter said to them, "Repent, and each one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Aramaic Bible in Plain English
    And Shimeon said to them, “Return to God and be immersed everyone of you, in the name of THE LORD JEHOVAH Yeshua, for release from sin, so that you may receive the gift of The Spirit of Holiness.”

    GOD'S WORD® Translation
    Peter answered them, "All of you must turn to God and change the way you think and act, and each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins will be forgiven. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift.

    Jubilee Bible 2000
    Then Peter said unto them, Repent and be baptized each one of you into the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    King James 2000 Bible
    Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    American King James Version
    Then Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    American Standard Version
    And Peter'said unto them, Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ unto the remission of your sins; and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Douay-Rheims Bible
    But Peter said to them: Do penance, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of your sins: and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    Darby Bible Translation
    And Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptised, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ, for remission of sins, and ye will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    English Revised Version
    And Peter said unto them, Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ unto the remission of your sins; and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    Webster's Bible Translation
    Then Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Weymouth New Testament
    "Repent," replied Peter, "and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ, with a view to the remission of your sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    World English Bible
    Peter said to them, "Repent, and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Young's Literal Translation
    and Peter said unto them, 'Reform, and be baptized each of you on the name of Jesus Christ, to remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit,

  2. #2
    dberrie2000
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    Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View PostWould this be an example of that--where God extends His salvational grace to them that obey Him?

    Acts 2:38--King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.
    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon View Post Acts 10: 46 uses “for” where “because” could be used. Salvation comes before any works (See Ephesians 2:9)
    Could anyone here produce a translation that has "because" used in the Acts2:38 verse? IMO--this is another example of the faith alone attempt to alter or deny what the scriptures bear testimony to--God gives His salvational grace to them that obey Him. It defies faith alone theology--so an alteration is demanded--change it to because--instead of "for":

    New International Version
    Peter replied, "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    New Living Translation
    Peter replied, "Each of you must repent of your sins and turn to God, and be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    English Standard Version
    And Peter said to them, “Repent and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    New American Standard Bible
    Peter said to them, "Repent, and each of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins; and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    King James Bible
    Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    Holman Christian Standard Bible
    Repent," Peter said to them, "and be baptized, each of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    International Standard Version
    Peter answered them, "Every one of you must repent and be baptized in the name of Jesus the Messiah for the forgiveness of your sins. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift.

    NET Bible
    Peter said to them, "Repent, and each one of you be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Aramaic Bible in Plain English
    And Shimeon said to them, “Return to God and be immersed everyone of you, in the name of THE LORD JEHOVAH Yeshua, for release from sin, so that you may receive the gift of The Spirit of Holiness.”

    GOD'S WORD® Translation
    Peter answered them, "All of you must turn to God and change the way you think and act, and each of you must be baptized in the name of Jesus Christ so that your sins will be forgiven. Then you will receive the Holy Spirit as a gift.

    Jubilee Bible 2000
    Then Peter said unto them, Repent and be baptized each one of you into the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    King James 2000 Bible
    Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    American King James Version
    Then Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    American Standard Version
    And Peter'said unto them, Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ unto the remission of your sins; and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Douay-Rheims Bible
    But Peter said to them: Do penance, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of your sins: and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    Darby Bible Translation
    And Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptised, each one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ, for remission of sins, and ye will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    English Revised Version
    And Peter said unto them, Repent ye, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ unto the remission of your sins; and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    Webster's Bible Translation
    Then Peter said to them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ, for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Weymouth New Testament
    "Repent," replied Peter, "and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ, with a view to the remission of your sins, and you shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    World English Bible
    Peter said to them, "Repent, and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of sins, and you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.

    Young's Literal Translation
    and Peter said unto them, 'Reform, and be baptized each of you on the name of Jesus Christ, to remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Spirit,


    Bump for anyone.

  3. #3
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    this is another example of the faith alone attempt to

    Its "grace alone"
    Not "faith alone".


    Your welcome,

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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    Its "grace alone"
    Not "faith alone".


    Your welcome,
    LOL.... It seems alanmolstad has begun his backpedalling.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by theway View Post
    LOL.... It seems alanmolstad has begun his backpedalling.
    “Among whom we all once lived in the p***ions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our tresp***es, made us alive together with Christ — by grace you have been saved.” Eph. 2:3-5


    All of God’s wrath, all of the condemnation we deserve, was poured out on Jesus. All of God’s demands for perfect righteousness were fulfilled by Christ. The moment we see (by grace) this truth and receive him in this way his death counts as our death and his condemnation as our condemnation and his righteousness as our righteousness, and God becomes 100% irrevocably for us forever before we knew or obeyed His commands.
    Paul is saying that, before regeneration, God’s wrath was on us. Those who are now saved were under wrath. This changed when God made us alive in Christ Jesus and awakened us to see the truth of Christ so that we received him as the one who died for us and as the one whose righteousness is counted as ours because of our union with Jesus. Before this happened to us, we were under God’s wrath. Then, because of faith in Christ and union with him, all God’s wrath was removed we are no longer blind and we want to obey His commands.

  6. #6
    alanmolstad
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    As Walter Martin said...It's not by faith alone nor works alone or any combination of the two but by Grace Alone though faith we are saved.

  7. #7
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    As Walter Martin said...It's not by faith alone nor works alone or any combination of the two but by Grace Alone though faith we are saved.
    Then why do the faith alone claim salvation comes through a faith alone theology? Walter Martin believed in the faith alone theology.

  8. #8
    alanmolstad
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    Would you like me to post the link again ?

  9. #9
    alanmolstad
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    Kind of weird.


    I post this same video over and over where Martin teaches what I'm saying and yet you act surprised?


    Someone needs to listen better

  10. #10
    alanmolstad
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    Once again. ..

    Not by faith alone
    Nor by works alone
    And not by any combination of the two

  11. #11
    alanmolstad
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    Is that clear enough for you?

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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    Kind of weird.


    I post this same video over and over where Martin teaches what I'm saying and yet you act surprised?


    Someone needs to listen better
    I saw the video... And yes, His ideas are just as contradictory and errant as yours are.

  13. #13
    alanmolstad
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    :30 seconds point....

  14. #14
    Saxon
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    Listen to Walter when he defines grace @ 41 seconds point.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon View Post
    Listen to Walter when he defines grace @ 41 seconds point.
    That's what I said, he makes absolutely no sense. According to his definition "Grace is God's Love" and since we know God loves everybody, does that mean Grace is given to everybody???
    The Bible also says in several places that God will give mercy to those who first extends mercy to others...
    So what he needs to explain is whether Grace is salvation?
    Is Faith salvation?
    When exactly does salvation come to an individual?

    Either way he will contradict himself, it's utter nonsense, made to make a person feel good about himself while remaining in sin.
    Last edited by theway; 02-27-2015 at 06:10 PM.

  16. #16
    Saxon
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    What is your definition of grace??

  17. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon View Post
    What is your definition of grace??
    In terms of God towards men; it would be God's divine help and blessings.

  18. #18
    Saxon
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    How about, "God's at***ude towards man"?
    Last edited by Saxon; 02-27-2015 at 07:48 PM.

  19. #19
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by Saxon View Post
    What is your definition of grace??
    LOVE.....its when Love moves the person to action.

    "Militant Love"

  20. #20
    alanmolstad
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    I claim that term.....

  21. #21
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    “Among whom we all once lived in the p***ions of our flesh, carrying out the desires of the body and the mind, and were by nature children of wrath, like the rest of mankind. But God, being rich in mercy, because of the great love with which he loved us, even when we were dead in our tresp***es, made us alive together with Christ — by grace you have been saved.” Eph. 2:3-5

    All of God’s wrath, all of the condemnation we deserve, was poured out on Jesus. All of God’s demands for perfect righteousness were fulfilled by Christ. The moment we see (by grace) this truth and receive him in this way his death counts as our death and his condemnation as our condemnation and his righteousness as our righteousness, and God becomes 100% irrevocably for us forever before we knew or obeyed His commands.
    Paul is saying that, before regeneration, God’s wrath was on us. Those who are now saved were under wrath. This changed when God made us alive in Christ Jesus and awakened us to see the truth of Christ so that we received him as the one who died for us and as the one whose righteousness is counted as ours because of our union with Jesus. Before this happened to us, we were under God’s wrath. Then, because of faith in Christ and union with him, all God’s wrath was removed we are no longer blind and we want to obey His commands.
    How does any of this negate the fact Paul taught that all who did not obey the gospel could not inherit the kingdom of God?

    2 Thessalonians 1:7-9---King James Version (KJV)
    7 And to you who are troubled rest with us, when the Lord Jesus shall be revealed from heaven with his mighty angels,
    8 In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God, and that obey not the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ:
    9 Who shall be punished with everlasting destruction from the presence of the Lord, and from the glory of his power;


    Disciple--the faith alone preach there are no acts of obedience that is necessary for eternal life---it's a faith without works in salvation, in the faith alone theology. They believe one is saved through dead faith:

    James 2:26---King James Version (KJV)
    26 For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

  22. #22
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    Once again. ..

    Not by faith alone
    Nor by works alone
    And not by any combination of the two
    They seem to literally not see this......
    They read the statement above,and their minds replace the words so it reads "Faith alone saves"
    Then they turn around and demand of me, "Where does it say man is saved by faith alone as you believe?"

    They just dont see what they are doing....

  23. #23
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    They seem to literally not see this......
    They read the statement above,and their minds replace the words so it reads "Faith alone saves"
    Then they turn around and demand of me, "Where does it say man is saved by faith alone as you believe?"
    Answer: No where in the Biblical text:

    James 2:24---New American Standard Bible (NASB)
    24 You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

    So why do the faith alone preach a gospel of salvation through a faith without works?

  24. #24
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    Once again. ..

    Not by faith alone
    Nor by works alone
    And not by any combination of the two
    that should be clear enough to put an end to the loop some of us seemed trapped in....

  25. #25
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    Answer: No where in the Biblical text:

    James 2:24---New American Standard Bible (NASB)
    24 You see that a man is justified by works and not by faith alone.

    So why do the faith alone preach a gospel of salvation through a faith without works?
    are you on drugs?

    some type of medication?

    Im not judgmental here, but it would explain where you keep getting "Faith alone" out of my posts...

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