If the Golden Plates were made available…what would happen?

[Radix]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

Pa Pa, to add to your list--no ark of the covenant, no Urim and Thummin, no breastplate---all of these were artifacts Jewish theology.

Let's see, all the artifacts listed did involve people we know ACTUALLY EXISTED. Outside the fictional creating mind of Joseph Smith, no proof for Nephites.

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by Radix

Let's see, all the artifacts listed did involve people we know ACTUALLY EXISTED. Outside the fictional creating mind of Joseph Smith, no proof for Nephites.

Please honor us with your vast knowledge and tell us, based on the evidence from the Book of Mormon (please provide references) what would you expect to find in the area you have determined to be the location (again provide references from the Book of Mormon to support your claim) that the Book took place.

And don't claim that you can't prove a negative. You are the one who claimed that there is no proof for the Nephites, so now you have to show why you make that claim. It is your claim, so support it. If you can't prove a negative, then you have no business making this claim.

Marvin

PS Eight witnesses testify that the plates existed and 4 witnesses claim to have had a witness from God and testify that the book is from God. That is my first level evidence that the Nephites existed.

[Radix]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

Please honor us with your vast knowledge and tell us, based on the evidence from the Book of Mormon (please provide references) what would you expect to find in the area you have determined to be the location (again provide references from the Book of Mormon to support your claim) that the Book took place.

And don't claim that you can't prove a negative. You are the one who claimed that there is no proof for the Nephites, so now you have to show why you make that claim. It is your claim, so support it. If you can't prove a negative, then you have no business making this claim.

Marvin

PS Eight witnesses testify that the plates existed and 4 witnesses claim to have had a witness from God and testify that the book is from God. That is my first level evidence that the Nephites existed.

Provide one substantive piece of evidence acceptable to at least half of the University archaeologists that would confirm the existence of Nephites. If you cannot, it is wishful thinking.

And you are right. There is no proof for a negative. Mormons claim Nephites are legitimate, it is up to you Marvin to provide evidence to support your claim. Nephites were NEVER mentioned in any of my school text books or lectures.

[jdjhere]

RussianWolfe:

Did the people called Narods of the Grand Lakes regions in southern Peru exist? If they DID, please give archeological and textual (historical) proof that they did . If they did NOT exist, please explain WHY you came to this conclusion. Thanks.

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by jdjhere

RussianWolfe:

Did the people called Narods of the Grand Lakes regions in southern Peru exist? If they DID, please give archeological and textual (historical) proof that they did . If they did NOT exist, please explain WHY you came to this conclusion. Thanks.

I am not making any claims of the sort you are asking for. If you want to know, the search it out for yourself.

Radix did make a claim and is stacking claims on top of claims. So your diversion isn't going to fly.

Marvin

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by Radix

Let's see, all the artifacts listed did involve people we know ACTUALLY EXISTED. Outside the fictional creating mind of Joseph Smith, no proof for Nephites.

Originally Posted by Radix

Provide one substantive piece of evidence acceptable to at least half of the University archaeologists that would confirm the existence of Nephites. If you cannot, it is wishful thinking.

And you are right. There is no proof for a negative. Mormons claim Nephites are legitimate, it is up to you Marvin to provide evidence to support your claim. Nephites were NEVER mentioned in any of my school text books or lectures.

Now you are changing your statements. See the enlarged highlighted portion above to review what you said. Now, since you have made the claim, please provide the evidence that has lead to your conclusion. It was your claim so now you have to put up or shut up.

To counter your challenge, please 'provide one substantive piece of evidence acceptable to at least half of the University archaeologists that would confirm the exitence of' the following: The Garden of Eden, the original stone tablet with the 10 commandments, Noah's Ark, the original holographs of any of the books of the Bible. When you have provided these evidences, then I will gladly provide the evidence of the Nephites.

Marvin

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

. . .then I will gladly provide the evidence of the Nephites.

Marvin

Does that mean you actually have any evidence for the Nephites living in the Americas OR are you pulling our leg Marvin?

[Radix]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

Now you are changing your statements. See the enlarged highlighted portion above to review what you said. Now, since you have made the claim, please provide the evidence that has lead to your conclusion. It was your claim so now you have to put up or shut up.

To counter your challenge, please 'provide one substantive piece of evidence acceptable to at least half of the University archaeologists that would confirm the exitence of' the following: The Garden of Eden, the original stone tablet with the 10 commandments, Noah's Ark, the original holographs of any of the books of the Bible. When you have provided these evidences, then I will gladly provide the evidence of the Nephites.

Marvin

Let's see, you want me to find you a garden, or a single stone or m****cripts thousands of years old. I am asking you to provide evidence of a civilization. I can provide evidence of a Jewish civilization.

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by Radix

Let's see, you want me to find you a garden, or a single stone or m****cripts thousands of years old. I am asking you to provide evidence of a civilization. I can provide evidence of a Jewish civilization.

Still trying to dodge the claim you made.

And still not able to support your claims. Typical. Keep dancing, Radix.

Marvin

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

Still trying to dodge the claim you made.

And still not able to support your claims. Typical. Keep dancing, Radix.

Marvin

Marvin there is absolutely no comparison between the evidence for the Bible verses the Book of Mormon. Why do you think that is?

[Radix]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

Still trying to dodge the claim you made.

And still not able to support your claims. Typical. Keep dancing, Radix.

Marvin

My only claim here is that the Jewish people did indeed exist in what we call ancient times. Now most education people would call this common sense. Only you would seem not to acknowledge this. Start using the eyes God gave you.

It is pathetic I provide a reference for ancient Jews, you provide NOTHING valid for Nephites, and yet you claim I am unable to support anything. Your entire world rests on a dead con artist who made claims while holding a rock in a hat over his face. As a con artist is the center of your being, it provides some insight why you play these shallow games.

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by Radix

My only claim here is that the Jewish people did indeed exist in what we call ancient times. Now most education people would call this common sense. Only you would seem not to acknowledge this. Start using the eyes God gave you.

It is pathetic I provide a reference for ancient Jews, you provide NOTHING valid for Nephites, and yet you claim I am unable to support anything. Your entire world rests on a dead con artist who made claims while holding a rock in a hat over his face. As a con artist is the center of your being, it provides some insight why you play these shallow games.

What is really pathetic is your continual running away from the claim that started this whole thing. I have even given you a reference and the complete post and yet you still avoid talking about your claim.

Thanks for providing the evidence that you have no ability to back up your claims.

Marvin

PS Why is it when ever I try to get you to support your claim, you change the subject?

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

What is really pathetic is your continual running away from the claim that started this whole thing.

Hey Marvin are you ever going to give us any proof for the Nephites living in the America?

[jdjhere]

RussianWolfe:

Did the people called Narods of the Grand Lakes regions in southern Peru exist? If they DID, please give archeological and textual (historical) proof that they did . If they did NOT exist, please explain WHY you came to this conclusion. Thanks.

Are you going to answer this RussianWolfe? It is NOT a diversion as you claim but a reasoned, researched scientific REASON why and how we know certain people and places existed in history. I can give you ZERO proof or evidence that the Narods existed or that there was a place called Grand Lakes in Peru. I came to the conclusion that they did not ever exist because there is no archeological or historical proof that they ever existed because as we all know, of course, I made them up. This is called common sense. Now, show us your proof historically and archeologically that Nephites existed and I for one will start to take you more seriously. Thanks for showing us in advance.

[Radix]

Originally Posted by Billyray

Hey Marvin are you ever going to give us any proof for the Nephites living in the America?

Of course he will not. His religion is too incompetent.

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by Radix

Of course he will not. His religion is too incompetent.

But you have not supported your claim. Why is it that I am the only one who is obligated to support my ***ertions, but you get off scott-free?

You made the claim and have not provided any evidence to support it. And you call me a coward?

Marvin

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

But you have not supported your claim.

Marvin

Marvin you are the one who has no evidence. Are you going to gives us any or not?

[Libby]

You have been given, at least, "some" evidence, Billy, and there are books and papers and tons more where that came from. Have you bothered with any of it?

[Radix]

Originally Posted by Libby

You have been given, at least, "some" evidence, Billy, and there are books and papers and tons more where that came from. Have you bothered with any of it?

Just where is the tons of evidence for Nephites?

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by Libby

You have been given, at least, "some" evidence, Billy, and there are books and papers and tons more where that came from.

If you think that there is REAL evidence then pick what you think is the best evidence for the Nephites in the Americas so we can discuss it.

[jdjhere]

BigJulie said: Did you watch the last video she gave in which it has been shown that the beliefs about the native americans in the past have been slowly refuted and that the culture is more in line with the Book of Mormon?

No, but I watched the first two, thinking it would show that their is proof for a race of people called Nephites in ancient America. Thanks BigJulie. I am really hoping to see if anybody in the last video talks about historical or archeological proof that the Nephites existed or my question will not be answered though and I will just see the last video as a smoke screen. Thanks again...here goes.

[jdjhere]

OK... I watched the 9:53 Minute video by Mormon Professor Daniel C Petersen and the 2:20 minute Video by the founder of ARMS John Welch and there is exactly ZERO evidence mentioned by EITHER of these men that there is either historical or archeological evidence that the Nephites were a REAL race of people that existed in ancient America. As a matter of fact, Nephites are not even MENTIONED at all. As a matter of fact, John Welch ADMITS that the LDS church, in his own words, "We don't have definitive proof yet..." about archelogical or historical proofs for the BOM. You guys owe me 12 minutes of my life back.

[RealFakeHair]

Okay, so it doesn't sound so spiritual as "Golden"
How bout the everlasting, but changing once-in-awhile Gospel of Latter day Saints?
Or Joseph Smith jr. sometimes Prophet, and full time hanky-panky?
Don't think so.
Golden Plates, if I could just find them, it would be better than winning the lottery.
I think I'll go have a walk in the woods.

[jdjhere]

Those videos proved NOTHING. They are just an LDS Professor and Lawyer SAYING "nuh-uh." That's it. Those videos are what I was pointed to as proof??!!?? I mean... c'mon guys! ANYTHING (Historical Writing's or Archeological finds) for SCIENTIFIC PROOF of the Nephite race of people existing (and PLEASE do not tell me you have already given me some). If those videos are your proof, then I KNOW Nephites never existed. Do you have anything else Historical or scientific? Thanks.

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by jdjhere

Those videos proved NOTHING. They are just an LDS Professor and Lawyer SAYING "nuh-uh." That's it. Those videos are what I was pointed to as proof??!!?? I mean... c'mon guys! ANYTHING (Historical Writing's or Archeological finds) for SCIENTIFIC PROOF of the Nephite race of people existing (and PLEASE do not tell me you have already given me some). If those videos are your proof, then I KNOW Nephites never existed. Do you have anything else Historical or scientific? Thanks.

In the eye of the beholder, or something?
Like finding the pot of gold at then end of the rainbow.
The Fountain of Youth, or a mormon that doesn't believe in UFOs.
It won't happen.