What price of a single Book of Mormon coin?

[urloony]

Originally Posted by James Banta

Loony Lonny.. Only the measure was different.. According to you it was closer to an ounce that a measure of the Shekel.. Just because a different measure was used doesn't mean that the measure wasn't a coin.. A people who were familiar with holding their gold and silver in the form of coins would have the measure of their exchangeable wealth in coins not a box of rare gold and silver ore. As I said you believe they used a box or a cup to measure their gold and silver.. By the authority of the Alma 11 p***age we see coins.. To bad that there are no coins.. But since there were never any Nephites either, it makes sense none exist.. IHS jim

Back to square one. Where does the Book of Mormon say they used coins?

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by urloony

You might have a point if Alma didn't specifically state that the Nephite system was different.

"And the names are given by the Nephites, for they did not reckon after the manner of the Jews who were at Jerusalem; neither did they measure after the manner of the Jews; but they altered their reckoning and their measure, according to the minds and the circumstances of the people..."
Alma 11:4

Whether it's a fictional account or not, the text is very specific with regard to its monetary system and coins are never mentioned.

You are proving my point here for me.
If the fictional Niephites didn't mint their coins like the jews of the Old Testament then how would it look?
First of all the jews didn't mint their coins with images, second, surely the fictional Nephites would have come up with a measure system to save time and for convenience, some kind of uniformity in indemnification, and purity.

[Snow Patrol]

Originally Posted by James Banta

Loony Lonny..

Uh James, you wouldn't by chance be making fun of someone's name or something more offensive like calling someone "silly" are you? We all know how you feel about that.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by Snow Patrol

Uh James, you wouldn't by chance be making fun of someone's name or something more offensive like calling someone "silly" are you? We all know how you feel about that.

No more than his choice of a handle in the first place.. If he can use it how he spelled it I can shorten it and turn the effect back onto him.. If he (as an example, called himself ImTed I would call Him Ted.. But he didn't do that now did he.. It used a name that could be considered the same attack that you charge me with.. You have seen me post to you before.. I call you Snow.. That is because your handle is not an attack on others but is that your complete handle, NO.. Just as you called me James.. Not my complete handle either.. Look at the way I address Julie.. She used a word Big in front of it.. I could run with that but since it is not an attack on others as Loony's is, I just call her Julie..

If Loony would change his handle to something a bit less provocative then he would have it turned around on him as it appears I am doing.. He charges all who see his posts that we are the ones who are loony.. He dished it out he can take it back.. I never called him silly.. I used the same language he uses to address other posters, LOONY.. Talk to him and get him to remove the attack language found in his handle but until then I will continue calling him Loony. IHS jim

[Snow Patrol]

And you are sure that URLoony is his evaluation of the posters here? It couldn't be his nickname? I have no idea, just wondering.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by urloony

Back to square one. Where does the Book of Mormon say they used coins?

Alma 11.. Do you want to go through all that again? The LDS church in it's online presents agrees with that statement.. The modernest in the church ignore the teaching of this held by the LDS church for will over 100 years. They have modified their position because of the lack of evidence that there was precolumbian usage of coins in that economy.. IHS jim

[urloony]

Originally Posted by James Banta

Alma 11.. Do you want to go through all that again? The LDS church in it's online presents agrees with that statement.. The modernest in the church ignore the teaching of this held by the LDS church for will over 100 years. They have modified their position because of the lack of evidence that there was precolumbian usage of coins in that economy.. IHS jim

But Jimmy, I already pointed out that the heading to Alma 11 has changed to reflect the abandonment of the idea the Nephites ever used coins. You are merely arguing to argue at this point.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by urloony

But Jimmy, I already pointed out that the heading to Alma 11 has changed to reflect the abandonment of the idea the Nephites ever used coins. You are merely arguing to argue at this point.

Yes you have and I accept that.. Can you accept that "prophets" of God believers that the p***age was about Nephite coins? Are you willing to acknowledge that to this day on the official LDS online site it is still there that a senine is a coin.. So that would indication that the idea that Nephite coins did exist is not completely abandoned by the church.. Can you see that? of are you going to argue from a point that like mine is extrascriptural? Or are you now telling me that chapter heading have the same authority as the p***age it's self? IHS jim

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by James Banta

Yes you have and I accept that.. Can you accept that "prophets" of God believers that the p***age was about Nephite coins? Are you willing to acknowledge that to this day on the official LDS online site it is still there that a senine is a coin.. So that would indication that the idea that Nephite coins did exist is not completely abandoned by the church.. Can you see that? of are you going to argue from a point that like mine is extrascriptural? Or are you now telling me that chapter heading have the same authority as the p***age it's self? IHS jim

Once a TBM permits a crack in the belief system created by Joseph Smith jr. Imginary mind, the **** will soon collapse.
The maze of mormonism is nothing more than a path of dead ends. Every time a TBM stands on their tippy toes to dare look over the hedges the LDS apologist pail up the fertilizer and water the hedgerow with excuses after excuse, and the hedge grows and grows until the TBM is trapped.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by urloony

In previous editions of the BoM the heading to Alma 11 stated:

"Nephite coinage set forth - Amulek contends with Zeezrom..."

As I posted previously, the most recent editions do not state "Nephite coinage," to reflect that the fact that the Nephites did not use coins. A monetary system does not require the use of coins as shown by the ancient Mayan monetary system.

I shouldn't have to point this out but will anyway lest you get confused, but chapter headings are not part of the original BoM text and are simply added for the benefit of the reader as chapter summaries and have been revised as necessary over the years since they were first added in 1920.

I believe that is what I have said here.. The chapter heading ARE not part of your scripture and therefore are meaningless as to defining the meaning of the p***ages. What is important here is what was taught by the early LDS leaders that are much closer to Smith and therefore the genesis of the BofM.. Today's modernists take the knowledge discovered by anthropologists and try to incorporate those discovered facts into Smith fiction. Sometimes it works sometimes it doesn't.. Alma 11 for over 100 Years was taught by the LDS church to be a coinage system. Changing the teaching to reflect the truth of how ancient American Indians traded precious metals is revisionist. I understand the need because holding the same teachings that mormonism was first taught flies in the face of reality just as much as the Jarodite ships, Or a headless man gasping for breath.. IHS jim

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by urloony

In the case of Nephite coins there is little relevance to what early leaders taught. I have yet to see a revelation that identifies coins as the monetary system of the Nephites. Rather it was an ***umption made at a time when far less was known about BoM lands. I have no problem with accepting the fact that a lack of coins archaeologically causes a re****ysis of the text. Do you believe this is NEVER done with the Biblical text? Furthermore, I have yet to find anything referring to “coins” prior to the 1920’s with regard to the Nephite monetary system. If anything the chapter heading to Alma 11 printed in 1920 is the “modernistic approach.”

This is a bold face lie and you a liar for stating it.

What does a boldless face liar look like? I have seen the portrait of Joseph Smith jr change over the past 100 years, so my guess is the face of a boldless liar keeps changing.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by Snow Patrol

And you are sure that URLoony is his evaluation of the posters here? It couldn't be his nickname? I have no idea, just wondering.

A new nickname is called for... IHS jim

[urloony]

Originally Posted by James Banta

A new nickname is called for... IHS jim

I will accept this as you officially conceding this debate. If it has come to mocking and then insisting for a name change you have simply run out of useful commentary for the OP.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by urloony

I will accept this as you officially conceding this debate. If it has come to mocking and then insisting for a name change you have simply run out of useful commentary for the OP.

It was Snow that started the train about your nickname on here.. I personally don;t care what your nick is.. As far as holding the idea the BofM teaches coinage I still stick to that.. You haven't shown me where any historic GA has denied that teaching. All I have seen is a redefinition of history by the LDS church to match discovered anthropology in terms of coins or no coins. But even with the move of the modernists there still is TODAY an official LDS claim that a senine is a coin.

Senine—Nephite coin (http://www.lds.org/scriptures/triple...g&query=senine) Look it up for yourself.. IHS jim

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by James Banta

It was Snow that started the train about your nickname on here.. I personally don;t care what your nick is.. As far as holding the idea the BofM teaches coinage I still stick to that.. You haven't shown me where any historic GA has denied that teaching. All I have seen is a redefinition of history by the LDS church to match discovered anthropology in terms of coins or no coins. But even with the move of the modernists there still is TODAY an official LDS claim that a senine is a coin.

Senine—Nephite coin (http://www.lds.org/scriptures/triple...g&query=senine) Look it up for yourself.. IHS jim

It doesn't matter what authority has said. It only matters what the Book of Mormon claims. Many have made claims about what the Book of Mormon is. The problem is most of them are attempting to force the Book of Mormon to be something it never claims to be. This coinage thing is your attempt to force the book to be saying something it does not say.

If you read the text carefully, you will not be able to say that it is talking about coins. Coins started near the time that Lehi left Jerusalem. Until that time, things were measured out. Just as the Book of Mormon says. These are weights and meansures.

Marvin

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

It doesn't matter what authority has said. It only matters what the Book of Mormon claims. Many have made claims about what the Book of Mormon is. The problem is most of them are attempting to force the Book of Mormon to be something it never claims to be. This coinage thing is your attempt to force the book to be saying something it does not say.

If you read the text carefully, you will not be able to say that it is talking about coins. Coins started near the time that Lehi left Jerusalem. Until that time, things were measured out. Just as the Book of Mormon says. These are weights and meansures.

Marvin

These people came from a civilization that measured their gold and silver in the form of coins. It would be as natural from them to do that as it was for the rel inhabitants of the Americas to use more of a barter system of fish, and farm produce to trade for the goods produced by others. Using gold and silver was just as important to these peoples as was the use of "brightly colored shells, bird feathers and animal skins (particularly Jaguar) were all highly prized status symbols. Stones and gemstones such as jade, obsidian and basalt, along with gold, copper, rubber, amber, cotton, fish, tobacco, chocolate, spices, salt and dyes were all important trade items. (The pre Columbian Civilisations of Central America - The Mesoamericans; https://sites.google.com/site/mediev...entral-america).. Unlike the teaching of the BofM Gold and silver were not the main ingredient of the per-Colombian barter economic system. There was no standard for trade it was what two parties of a trade agreed what was fair. Shells and feathers were more important.. That is the truth of the medium of exchange in ancient America. It was NOT based in Gold and Silver.. In a Hebrew culture Gold and silver were that medium and it is carried forward by Smith that such metals were also used as the standard of trade established by the king.. If that were the case then the people would have used the same style of their use as they were a custom, that would have been coins..

Like it or not the Temple Sheckle was well established before The fictional Lehi left Jerusalem. Coins were established as a medium of trade and not a mere measure of gold silver or grain.. IHS Jim

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

It doesn't matter what authority has said. It only matters what the Book of Mormon claims. Many have made claims about what the Book of Mormon is. The problem is most of them are attempting to force the Book of Mormon to be something it never claims to be. This coinage thing is your attempt to force the book to be saying something it does not say.

If you read the text carefully, you will not be able to say that it is talking about coins. Coins started near the time that Lehi left Jerusalem. Until that time, things were measured out. Just as the Book of Mormon says. These are weights and meansures.

Marvin

There is only 1 fact, or claim related to the Book of Mormon, and it is this: it is a work of fiction.
Now for mormonism it means much more to you, and I understand it, but for us who know better, I remind you there is but 1 claim.

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

Just read today where 15 million dollars worth of First century Roman coins were found in the UK. This leads me to wonder what a single Book of Mormon coin would be worth if found?

If found, it would be the only real proof to any of the claims of the Mormons....

It would be the proof that they could use to finally have something to point to to support their whole religion.

Thus if such single coin were found and it was real?....it would be priceless.

My guess is that the area where it would be found would be fenced off, and the coin itself would have a whole new building constructed for it's display.....

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

If found, it would be the only real proof to any of the claims of the Mormons....

It would be the proof that they could use to finally have something to point to to support their whole religion.

Thus if such single coin were found and it was real?....it would be priceless.

My guess is that the area where it would be found would be fenced off, and the coin itself would have a whole new building constructed for it's display.....

If such a coin was found the inscription on the face of the coin would read, "In Joseph Smith jr. We trust"!

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

If such a coin was found the inscription on the face of the coin would read, "In Joseph Smith jr. We trust"!

my guess is that because the guy was well known to be running around digging up other peoples money, that sooner or later someone inspired by such actions will try to come forward with a 'found" coin.....

its like with Scientology and the guy who started it, and the fact they he was a well known writer of Sci-Fi, thus its not really a big leap to believe that sooner or later one of his followers will come forward with a claim that they have made "contact" with life from another world...

its just what you have to expect from the type of people that get sucked into believing in this type of stuff...



so a coin that gets "found" in order to support Mormonism?....yes, it could one day be in the news....

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by realfakehair

just read today where 15 million dollars worth of first century roman coins were found in the uk. This leads me to wonder what a single book of mormon coin would be worth if found?

can things made of metal be dated?

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

can things made of metal be dated?

The metal plate in my head is dated to 1974.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

The metal plate in my head is dated to 1974.

Is inscribed with a new message from God? Maybe we should cut it out and make sure.. IHS jim