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Thread: "Heaven"

  1. #251
    Billyray
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    You can pick and choose what is believable and discard what is not.
    What is the underlying reason for rejecting the Bible?

  2. #252
    Libby
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billyray View Post
    What is the underlying reason for rejecting the Bible?
    The same underlying reason for accepting some of it. The Holy Spirit.

  3. #253
    TheSword99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    The same underlying reason for accepting some of it. The Holy Spirit.
    It's this Holy Spirit that men were under the inspiration of when they penned God's word, the Holy Scriptures. Why then would the Holy Spirit tell you to reject some of it?

  4. #254
    Libby
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSword99 View Post
    It's this Holy Spirit that men were under the inspiration of when they penned God's word, the Holy Scriptures. Why then would the Holy Spirit tell you to reject some of it?
    Because I don't believe all of it was inspired (as you seem to).. I am not getting that message from the Holy Spirit.

  5. #255
    Billyray
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    I am not getting that message from the Holy Spirit.
    So you believe that the HS tells one person that the Bible including the parts that you reject is true and the same HS tell you that it is false?

  6. #256
    Libby
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billyray View Post
    So you believe that the HS tells one person that the Bible including the parts that you reject is true and the same HS tell you that it is false?
    No. I think some people just ***ume that because God's word exists in the Bible that every word is from God (or perhaps simply because they have been told that). Wrong ***umption, IMO.

  7. #257
    Billyray
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    No. I think some people just ***ume that because God's word exists in the Bible that every word is from God (or perhaps simply because they have been told that).
    But that is not what I asked.

    So you believe that the HS tells one person that the Bible including the parts that you reject is true and the same HS tell you that it is false?

  8. #258
    Libby
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billyray View Post
    But that is not what I asked.

    So you believe that the HS tells one person that the Bible including the parts that you reject is true and the same HS tell you that it is false?
    No, of course not. I thought that was clear, in the answer I gave.

  9. #259
    Billyray
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    No, of course not. I thought that was clear, in the answer I gave.
    The HS is not going to tell you that part of the Bible is false and another person that it is true. So how do you explain that?

  10. #260
    Libby
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billyray View Post
    The HS is not going to tell you that part of the Bible is false and another person that it is true. So how do you explain that?
    I already explained it....my opinion, at least.

    I think some people ***ume it's all true, perhaps, because that's what they have been told. I held that ***umption, myself, and for that very reason, for awhile.

  11. #261
    Billyray
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post

    I think some people ***ume it's all true, perhaps, because that's what they have been told. I held that ***umption, myself, and for that very reason, for awhile.
    But you are avoiding what I am actually asking. How do you explain that the HS tells you that part of the Bible is false and a Christian that the same section of scripture is true?

  12. #262
    Libby
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    Quote Originally Posted by Billyray View Post
    But you are avoiding what I am actually asking. How do you explain that the HS tells you that part of the Bible is false and a Christian that the same section of scripture is true?
    And, I am telling you that I don't believe the Holy Spirit is telling anyone that the entire Bible, as in, "every single word", is inspired by God. That is not the HS, if that is the message you are getting. That's how I explain it.

    And, I'm sure you will explain it by telling me that I am not hearing the HS.

  13. #263
    Billyray
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    And, I am telling you that I don't believe the Holy Spirit is telling anyone that the entire Bible, as in, "every single word", is inspired by God. That is not the HS, if that is the message you are getting. That's how I explain it.
    Lets look at the flood. I believe in the flood and believe that the HS has confirmed this truth to me. You don't believe in the flood and that the HS has witnessed to you. Can you explain that?

  14. #264
    Libby
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    See the post right above yours. AGAIN, that is my answer.

    You love that merry-go-round, don't you?

  15. #265
    TheSword99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    I already explained it....my opinion, at least.

    I think some people ***ume it's all true, perhaps, because that's what they have been told. I held that ***umption, myself, and for that very reason, for awhile.
    Some ***ume the BoM is true. They've been told that all their lives or for many years, that they just ignore all the errors. The Holy Spirit revealed to me it isn't. In fact, with spiritual discernment, one needs only to read it, not pray about it, and see that it's not of God. There isn't another Testament or Gospel of Jesus Christ.

  16. #266
    TheSword99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    And, I am telling you that I don't believe the Holy Spirit is telling anyone that the entire Bible, as in, "every single word", is inspired by God. That is not the HS, if that is the message you are getting. That's how I explain it.

    And, I'm sure you will explain it by telling me that I am not hearing the HS.
    The Holy Spirit is God. Millions have given their lives for the Holy Bible. The Scriptures are foolishness to those who are perishing. I didn't say it. God did in His Word. If we truly want the indwelling of the Holy Spirit we must be born-again.

  17. #267
    Libby
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSword99 View Post
    Some ***ume the BoM is true. They've been told that all their lives or for many years, that they just ignore all the errors. The Holy Spirit revealed to me it isn't. In fact, with spiritual discernment, one needs only to read it, not pray about it, and see that it's not of God. There isn't another Testament or Gospel of Jesus Christ.
    I never ***umed the BofM was true. Actually, just the opposite. I ***umed it was false...until I read it. I did have a very spiritual experience with that book, which revolved around the death of my father. I don't, at this time, believe it is "true" in the same sense that most active LDS believe that, but I do know that God spoke to me through that book.

    I now know that God can speak to us in any way he chooses...actually, in any way we are willing to hear him. He is always available and willing to reveal himself, in whatever way we can best understand, in the moment.

    So, that is how I, currently, see/interpret my experience with the Book of Mormon.

    I think real relationship with God/Christ is extremely personal and may have nothing to do with books or religion or priesthood. It is about relationship, loving, listening, experiencing...

  18. #268
    TheSword99
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    Quote Originally Posted by Libby View Post
    Because I don't believe all of it was inspired (as you seem to).. I am not getting that message from the Holy Spirit.
    Joseph Smith didn't get that message either. It was a fallen angel that told him the bible was corrupted. All other churches were corrupt and not to join any of them. God would never have said it.

  19. #269
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    the 'stories" are a little too much like stories of UFOs...LOL

    I reject them all....
    I reject them, because of my own personal history....
    I reject them because they all seem a bit "practiced'
    I reject them because they seem to be aimed a bit too much at the listener.
    I reject them because they seem to lack that "smell" of realness about them, they smell rather of being faked to gain fame.

  20. #270
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    I reject them, because of my own personal history....
    I reject them because they all seem a bit "practiced'
    I reject them because they seem to be aimed a bit too much at the listener.
    I reject them because they seem to lack that "smell" of realness about them, they smell rather of being faked to gain fame.

    When I hear such a story by someone, it just seems to be a bit too "rehe****d' to be real.
    The story seems to my ear to lack the signs of being an eye-witness account, and seems more like a story that is scripted to be like other such stories.
    Seems more like it aimed at being sold, rather than being told to be a true account of an experience.

  21. #271
    alanmolstad
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    In the end....

    When you read about a Near-Death Experience (NDE) you want to know if what is said is true?, but there is just no way to know.

    Im not sure such things are of a type that you can put them to the test.
    It's as I said at the start of this topic, its like attempting to tell a person that their dream was 'not real'.

    It's hard to convince a person that just woke up that the dream was not real, for it sure seems real to them at the time.

  22. #272
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    Quote Originally Posted by TheSword99 View Post
    All other churches were corrupt and not to join any of them. God would never have said it.
    Hi Sword:

    Then could you explain why the Reformation--and the numerous new denominations--with a different theology? What denominations did some of the Reformers not believe was corrupted? And, if they believed there was some denominations not corrupted--then why did the Reformers start new denominations--instead of just joining with the ones that they felt were not corrupted?

    If God had His church here on this earth during the time of the Reformation--then who authorized the Reformers to start new denominations? What account do we have of the heavenly events which transpired which authorized the Reformers to do so?

    D&C 110
    1 The veil was taken from our minds, and the eyes of our understanding were opened.
    2 We saw the Lord standing upon the breastwork of the pulpit, before us; and under his feet was a paved work of pure gold, in color like amber.
    3 His eyes were as a flame of fire; the hair of his head was white like the pure snow; his countenance shone above the brightness of the sun; and his voice was as the sound of the rushing of great waters, even the voice of Jehovah, saying:
    4 I am the first and the last; I am he who liveth, I am he who was slain; I am your advocate with the Father.
    5 Behold, your sins are forgiven you; you are clean before me; therefore, lift up your heads and rejoice.
    6 Let the hearts of your brethren rejoice, and let the hearts of all my people rejoice, who have, with their might, built this house to my name.
    7 For behold, I have accepted this house, and my name shall be here; and I will manifest myself to my people in mercy in this house.
    8 Yea, I will appear unto my servants, and speak unto them with mine own voice, if my people will keep my commandments, and do not pollute this holy house.
    9 Yea the hearts of thousands and tens of thousands shall greatly rejoice in consequence of the blessings which shall be poured out, and the endowment with which my servants have been endowed in this house.
    10 And the fame of this house shall spread to foreign lands; and this is the beginning of the blessing which shall be poured out upon the heads of my people. Even so. Amen.
    11 After this vision closed, the heavens were again opened unto us; and Moses appeared before us, and committed unto us the keys of the gathering of Israel from the four parts of the earth, and the leading of the ten tribes from the land of the north. 12 After this, Elias appeared, and committed the dispensation of the gospel of Abraham, saying that in us and our seed all generations after us should be blessed.
    13 After this vision had closed, another great and glorious vision burst upon us; for Elijah the prophet, who was taken to heaven without tasting death, stood before us, and said:
    14 Behold, the time has fully come, which was spoken of by the mouth of Malachi—testifying that he [Elijah] should be sent, before the great and dreadful day of the Lord come—
    15 To turn the hearts of the fathers to the children, and the children to the fathers, lest the whole earth be smitten with a curse—
    16 Therefore, the keys of this dispensation are committed into your hands; and by this ye may know that the great and dreadful day of the Lord is near, even at the doors.

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