Why is Mormonism false..

[James Banta]

The number one reason is BECAUSE IT HAS CHANGED GOD FROM WHAT HE IS REVEALED TO BE AND MADE INTO THE LIKENESS OF A MAN. The second reason is because they deny the singularity of God an opting for a teaching that billion of billions of Gods exist in the cosmos and that three exist for this world.. That is a denial of the Bible that teaching that God must have be lying when he said "Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.". Time and again the LDS deny that the Words of God are truth. Jesus said that His words would never p*** away and yet if they are corrupted then the word we have is worthless.. Remember Jesus is the Word, and the Word is God (John 1:1).. But that is only if the Bible is God's truth.. The requires faith in Jesus and that faith is the only hope we have to access the grace of God unto salvation.. IHS jim

[Sir]

Originally Posted by James Banta

The number one reason is BECAUSE IT HAS CHANGED GOD FROM WHAT HE IS REVEALED TO BE AND MADE INTO THE LIKENESS OF A MAN.

Actually, the Bible teaches us that man was made in the likeness of God, which the LDS believe.

The second reason is because they deny the singularity of God an opting for a teaching that billion of billions of Gods exist in the cosmos and that three exist for this world..

Actually, YOU deny the "singularity" of God because God is not singular but plural (3).

Secondly, LDS do not teach a doctrine of "billions of billions of Gods", so once again the anti-LDS resort to deceit and purposefully spreading misleading info.

[James Banta]

[Sir;148080]Actually, the Bible teaches us that man was made in the likeness of God, which the LDS believe.

Since we are taught in the New Testament That Jesus is the image of the INVISIBLE God, and Jesus would have been a mere preexistant spirit at the time of the creation, the whole concept of being created in the physical likeness of God is impossible.. UNLESS you have decided to pick and choose the parts of the Bible you will believe and which parts you will reject.. Because of the Biblical descriptions of God it is far more likely that we are like Him in other ways.. Since there in one God (Deut 6:4, Mark 12:28, Isaiah 43:10-11, 44:8). And that the Father is God (John 20:17). That Jesus is God (John 1:1). And that the Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4) These three Divine Person must be that one true God.. They are Triune, we are triune. We are Body, Mind, and Spirit.. Of any one of those elements are missing we die.. We are therefore created in His image.. TRIUNE.. The LDS church denies that but their interpretation doesn't fit into the whole of the Biblical context..

Actually, YOU deny the "singularity" of God because God is not singular but plural (3).

WHAT? I who believe the Bible as it teaches that the Lord our God is one LORD, deny that singularity because I deny plurality? Thank you for making that so clear (NOT)..

Secondly, LDS do not teach a doctrine of "billions of billions of Gods", so once again the anti-LDS resort to deceit and purposefully spreading misleading info.

You deny the prophetic authority of your own Leaders.. It was taught, and agreed to by the membership of the LDS church, in conference that:

If we should take a million of worlds like this and number their particles, we should find that there are more Gods than there are particles of matter in those worlds" (Orson Pratt, Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, p. 345).

So there it is right out of your own church owned information.. A prophet of the LDS Church taught that there are more Gods in existence than can be numbered.. With a doctrine of exaltation (Godhood) for all it's worthy members what else could there be but Billions on Billions of Gods? But the God of the Bible tells us that He is unaware of any of these other Gods.. But you know more than that simpleton God of the Bible, don't you? IHS jim

[theway]

Originally Posted by James Banta

The number one reason is BECAUSE IT HAS CHANGED GOD FROM WHAT HE IS REVEALED TO BE AND MADE INTO THE LIKENESS OF A MAN.

We did not make God into our likeness, it was God who made man in His likeness, and then commanded us to change our nature to be Godlike, I.e. Christlike.
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:..

Why do you find Gods image, nature and likeness to be so disgusting to you?

Originally Posted by James Banta

The second reason is because they deny the singularity of God an opting for a teaching that billion of billions of Gods exist in the cosmos and that three exist for this world.. That is a denial of the Bible that teaching that God must have be lying when he said "Is there a God beside me? yea, there is no God; I know not any.". Time and again the LDS deny that the Words of God are truth. Jesus said that His words would never p*** away and yet if they are corrupted then the word we have is worthless.. Remember Jesus is the Word, and the Word is God (John 1:1).. But that is only if the Bible is God's truth.. The requires faith in Jesus and that faith is the only hope we have to access the grace of God unto salvation.. IHS jim

I believe there is One God and there is no God beside Him, so I have no idea what you are talking about. Perhaps you need to explain?

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by theway

We did not make God into our likeness, it was God who made man in His likeness, and then commanded us to change our nature to be Godlike, I.e. Christlike.
Gen 1:26 And God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:..

Why do you find Gods image, nature and likeness to be so discussing to you?


I believe there is One God and there is no God beside Him, so I have no idea what you are talking about. Perhaps you need to explain?

If God made man in his likeness as in the way the LDS inc. Say man was; (in human form) then what image was woman created in?

[theway]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

If God made man in his likeness as in the way the LDS inc. Say man was; (in human form) then what image was woman created in?

I'm sorry, I'm going by what the Bible says, I don't even know how the LDS defines likeness.

But then, neither you or James described what being One means, or what "likeness" means.

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by theway

I'm sorry, I'm going by what the Bible says. . .

Genesis 1"26 Then God said, “Let us make mankind in our image, in our likeness. . ."

Who are "US" in this verse?

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by theway

I'm sorry, I'm going by what the Bible says, I don't even know how the LDS defines likeness.

But then, neither you or James described what being One means, or what "likeness" means.

Well, let me help you out here. First, we can agree man is different than any other creature on earth. Second, earth is man's domain, he rules in a earthly way. Thrid, man has an eternal soul, and forth the Georgia Bull dawgs rules college football. Fifth, if we are made in the image of the mormon god, then what has kept mankind from busting out into full power of the universe Iron Man like Super man? Sixth, as far as we know, man is the same today as he was when he was first created?

[MacG]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

Well, let me help you out here. First, we can agree man is different than any other creature on earth. Second, earth is man's domain, he rules in a earthly way. Thrid, man has an eternal soul, and forth the Georgia Bull dawgs rules college football. Fifth, if we are made in the image of the mormon god, then what has kept mankind from busting out into full power of the universe Iron Man like Super man? Sixth, as far as we know, man is the same today as he was when he was first created?

forth the Georgia Bull dawgs rules college football.

"Can you say A.D.D? I knew you could."

Squirrel!

[nrajeffreturns]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

... forth the Georgia Bull dawgs rules college football.

Sorry, I was doing pretty good in agreeing with you on the other items, but this one I can't go along with.

Does that mean I am going to hell?

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by nrajeffreturns

Sorry, I was doing pretty good in agreeing with you on the other items, but this one I can't go along with.

Does that mean I am going to hell?

Yes! Repent while you can.

[MacG]

Originally Posted by theway

I believe there is One God and there is no God beside Him...

Do you believe in exaltation?

[theway]

Originally Posted by MacG

Do you believe in exaltation?

Of course...

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by theway

Of course...

Then you believe in an endless chain of Gods extending back into eternity past.. One the Father in heaven of the one following.. As it is your hope to become a Father in Heaven to a new generation of spirit children.. You would therefore make it your glory to bring them to immortality and ETERNAL LIFE.. A generation of Gods that will follow you.. In short a quick example of why there are Billions on Billions of Gods in existence.. Exaltation is therefore a erred doctrine that denies the Godhood that the God of the Bible has taken just for Himself.. IHS jim

[MacG]

Originally Posted by theway

Of course...

Earlier you said "I believe there is One God and there is no God beside Him". Then How do you reconcile Jesus being God and His Father Being God?

[nrajeffreturns]

Maybe in Moses' time there was no God beside Yahweh, but from NT times onward, things seem to have changed:

Stephen claimed he saw a deity standing beside God--standing on the right side of Him, I believe he said.

That deity's name is Jesus Christ, God's Son and a deity every bit as much as His Father is.

[MacG]

Originally Posted by nrajeffreturns

Maybe in Moses' time there was no God beside Yahweh, but from NT times onward, things seem to have changed:

Stephen claimed he saw a deity standing beside God--standing on the right side of Him, I believe he said.

That deity's name is Jesus Christ, God's Son and a deity every bit as much as His Father is.

Not asking Moses but I am asking theway about

I believe there is One God and there is no God beside Him,

and another becoming a God. I mean if not beside God where will that one be?

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by nrajeffreturns

Maybe in Moses' time there was no God beside Yahweh, but from NT times onward, things seem to have changed:

Stephen claimed he saw a deity standing beside God--standing on the right side of Him, I believe he said.

That deity's name is Jesus Christ, God's Son and a deity every bit as much as His Father is.

Things changed? You mean God changed and no more does He hold that after Him will no God be formed.. It suddenly became His divine will to make other Gods? When did He decide to make this change? Was it before the world was formed? After all doesn't the Bible teach us that Jesus made all things visible and invisible? Isn't Jesus the Word that was with God in the beginning, the Word that was God? So when again was Jesus made God? How is it that Jesus could be God before the Lord God said that He would never form another God, not even for this world? You are not making any sense at all in this doctrine that "THINGS SEEN TO HAVE CHANGED".. Remember God has also promised us that He will not change (Mal 3:6). Who is it we should believe you telling us that "THINGS SEEN TO HAVE CHANGED" or God saying that "I am the LORD, I change not".. I for one believe the Lord over you.. IHS jim

[nrajeffreturns]

Originally Posted by James Banta

Things changed?

Yup. Why do you deny the scriptures by claiming otherwise?

When one deity says to another deity "Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool" then it seems obvious that things will change, as soon as the one deity makes the other's enemies his footstool.

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by nrajeffreturns

Yup. Why do you deny the scriptures by claiming otherwise?

When one deity says to another deity "Sit thou at my right hand, until I make thine enemies thy footstool" then it seems obvious that things will change, as soon as the one deity makes the other's enemies his footstool.

Jeff, Christians DON'T DENY that there are more than one person who is God. We have always said that God is the Father, Son., and Holy Spirit.. How often have I explained that to you. You still insist that the Father is a God that the Son is a God, and that the Holy Spirit is a God.. God says that He is one Lord.. So The Father, one person, the Son, a second person, and the Holy Spirit, a third person, are one God.. They are eternally God, One was not formed by the other.. Yes the Father has a place for the Son, at His right hand. He will put down all His enemies. That in No way contradicts the statements of God as give to us By the Holy Spirit through the prophets that the Lord our God is One Lord, That no God was formed after one was already God. That God is s t u p i d and doesn't know about some other true God's existence.. All it means is the Father has a place for the Son and will put down His enemies.. Just what has changed in your mind? The location from which Jesus will rule? IHS jim

[nrajeffreturns]

Originally Posted by James Banta

Jeff, Christians DON'T DENY that there are more than one person who is God.

But SOME Christians--the Trinitarian ones--DO deny that the separate persons can sit on thrones next to each other, because Trinitarians believe that all 3 persons are one BEING. Like a human with multiple personality disorder.
In my personal opinion, that doctrine is an abomination in God's sight.

Yes the Father has a place for the Son, at His right hand.

How can that happen if they are both the same being?

All it means is the Father has a place for the Son and will put down His enemies.. Just what has changed in your mind? The location from which Jesus will rule? IHS jim

That is a good point you raised there. If Jesus will reign over this earth after it's been turned into a glorified Paradise, then His Father will be somewhere else, reigning over the places that Jesus won't be reigning over.

Anyway, if one of the persons (Jehovah acc. to the Psalm) told Adonai to sit on His right until Jehovah had made Adonai's enemies His footstool, then once that was done, Adonai was no longer going to be on the right of Jehovah. So in my mind, THAT is what has changed. And indeed, in the NT we see when it happened. Heb 1:13. From that point on, Jesus is on the right hand of His Father. That's what Stephen saw.

[James Banta]

[nrajeffreturns;148166]But SOME Christians--the Trinitarian ones--DO deny that the separate persons can sit on thrones next to each other, because Trinitarians believe that all 3 persons are one BEING. Like a human with multiple personality disorder.
In my personal opinion, that doctrine is an abomination in God's sight.

Trinitarians believe that there are three Persons that are one God.. Three separate and distinct Persons.. These three Person are one Being, they are the same nature, the same essence. One in will, thought, righteousness, sharing the same Being.. One God three Persons.. That is why it's called a Trinitarian meaning three.


Trinity
Also called Blessed Trinity, Holy Trinity. the union of three persons (Father, Son, and Holy Ghost) in one Godhead, or the threefold personality of the one Divine Being.

a group of three; triad.

the state of being threefold or triple. (Dictionary.com)

By that definition the LDS church is Trinitarian.. Do you not hold that there is a "union of three persons (Father, Son, and Holy Ghost) in one Godhead"? According to the dictionary that is a trinitarian belief..

How can that happen if they are both the same being?

It can happen because they are not the same Person.. They are the same God the same Being.. You are thinking of natural beings and not the Divine Being..

That is a good point you raised there. If Jesus will reign over this earth after it's been turned into a glorified Paradise, then His Father will be somewhere else, reigning over the places that Jesus won't be reigning over.

Just where does it say that? IFf we conclude that they are three independent Gods then we have broken the first of the 10 commandments in the Bible -

"You shall have no other gods besides me."� (Deut 5:7).

So, it stands to reason that they cannot be independent.

To summarize Jesus says "I and the Father are one"� (John 10:38, 17:11,21)

"I am in the Father and the Father is in me"� (John 14:11) .

This means Jesus and the Father must be the same God but distinct. Now let’s consider what Jesus says about the Holy Spirit:

"I will send the Spirit of truth" for he lives with and will be in you" I am in my Father, and you are in me, and I am in you"�. (John 14:17-18, 20)

Now we have to solve this riddle: How can the Father and Son be within each other at once? How can the Son and the Holy Spirit be in me at once? The answer is: Only if they are one and the same yet distinct persons. And it stands to reason as we put together these facts that they are the same God, but different persons. Can I re***ure with the following: it doesn’t matter if we can’t imagine how this works in our minds! It is perplexing because there is nothing we have seen physically in our lives that can accurately illustrate this mystery. However, it is important to realize it is an eternal truth which the Bible has revealed to us! It’s not man made. There is a way that seems right to a man but the end thereof are the ways of death (Proverbs 14:12).. Stop worrying about How God can be One Lord and yet three persons and trust that He said that is the way it is and He doesn't lie.. You are trying to examine the divine by human abilities.. All you are doing is breaking the commandment to have no other Gods before YHWH is saying that you believe in three Gods..

Anyway, if one of the persons (Jehovah acc. to the Psalm) told Adonai to sit on His right until Jehovah had made Adonai's enemies His footstool, then once that was done, Adonai was no longer going to be on the right of Jehovah. So in my mind, THAT is what has changed. And indeed, in the NT we see when it happened. Heb 1:13. From that point on, Jesus is on the right hand of His Father. That's what Stephen saw.

Stephen saw Jesus on the right hand of the invisible God.. Stephen never saw the Father. He saw Jesus and Him on God's right hand. All the Bible must be true or none of it is.. Therefore the Person who Jesus stood by was invisible and only in His glory was He perceived by Stephen.. If that is not so then Paul was NOT an Apostle but a liar as he taught us that :

Col 1:12-15
Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature

So what part is the truth to you and what part is a lie? Did Stephen see the Father or Did He see Jesus on the right hand of the invisible God? I believe that second because all the scripture in the truth for me not just the parts of it I want to be the truth.. IHS jim

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by nrajeffreturns

Maybe in Moses' time there was no God beside Yahweh, but from NT times onward, things seem to have changed:

So you believe that in the OT the only God was Jesus? God the Father was not a God in the OT?

In Genesis 1 where it says "Let US make man in our image", who are the "US" in this verse?

[nrajeffreturns]

Originally Posted by Billyray

So you believe that in the OT the only God was Jesus?

Wrong. I believe there is a OT verse that quotes one deity telling another to sit beside Him until a specific event occurs. The implication is that things will change when the event occurs.

God the Father was not a God in the OT?

Of course He was a God. He was also beside another God--Yahweh.

In Genesis 1 where it says "Let US make man in our image", who are the "US" in this verse?

The evidence suggests that the two deities were El and YHVH.

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by nrajeffreturns

Wrong. I believe there is a OT verse that quotes one deity telling another to sit beside Him until a specific event occurs. The implication is that things will chance when the event occurs.

Originally Posted by nrajeffreturns

Maybe in Moses' time there was no God beside Yahweh, but from NT times onward, things seem to have changed:

Your two statement conflict. Can you explain that?