What's the moral difference?

[God-free]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

there is a connection here.....between the robber and god...from a point of view to be sure.


lets go back to the beginning and look at how this all got started.

God made man.
God put man in the garden to tend to it's care.
God told man that he could enjoy all the food found on the trees of the garden he was tending and careing for.
Then God told the man not to eat of the tree smack in the middle of the garden...do that and die.


So what we have an a type of contract between God and man.
Where man tends a garden and gets to eat and live off food from the garden.
But also part of the contract is the prohibition against eating one food on sentence of death.

This is not really the type of an agreement you enter into with a robber, but it does look a lot like the arrangement you might make with a King or owner of the land you live on and work for.




Now how did this contract end up?
Well the man violates the part of the contract about not eating one food, and thus he is sentenced to death...
The problem is that right after this the man begins to reproduce.
And the "death" that came because of the contract violation and the fact that the man reproduced after the violation, the death of this single man was p***ed on to his children...over and over....year after year...child after child.

All born after the same sentence of death p***ed on due to the violation of the contract.

all doomed.
The whole human "experiment" is a total FAIL.

Thus enter into the story the person of Christ...who is not only 100% man, and so under the same sentence as the rest of the men, but also 100% God.

In the person of Christ the whole of humanity has the opportunity to be "redeemed' under the the same contract that the first man was under...
For as we read, there was even at the start the understanding in God's eye that only He would be able to make whole the broken contract between God and man.

Hello alanmolstad. Am I correct to ***ume that you take the Adam and Eve story literally? If so, I'll take what you've written here and make a separate thread to address it. It won't be right away, though. I have some things to do this morning but I will get to it sometime today.

So yes to be fair, to some who are unbelievers it does look from their point of view that "God holds a gun to man's head, "Believe in me or else""
But from another point of view what we are seeing is a rope being tossed down to ones who have fallen into a deep dark pit.

It does, indeed, look like God is saying "Believe in me or else." It looks that way to me and to some believers I know who don't believe the same things about God that you and cheachea seem to.

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by God-free

Hello alanmolstad. Am I correct to ***ume that you take the Adam and Eve story literally?

I attempt to make use of the story in my post to help describe how I look at the relationship God has with both humanity and the whole universe in general.

The way I see it, and from what Im looking at in the text, it seems to resemble at many points a "contract" or a "covenant" between two parties....
The relationship that we read about between the man and the Lord in Genesis seems like a case of a violated contract, with yet a hint of redemption there in it as well.

But I dont disagree that to some unbelievers, that the message they hear about seems to them to be a case where a Crazy guy with a gun holds it to humanity's head and demands worship or else.....

[God-free]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

I attempt to make use of the story in my post to help describe how I look at the relationship God has with both humanity and the whole universe in general.

The way I see it, and from what Im looking at in the text, it seems to resemble at many points a "contract" or a "covenant" between two parties....
The relationship that we read about between the man and the Lord in Genesis seems like a case of a violated contract, with yet a hint of redemption there in it as well.

But I dont disagree that to some unbelievers, that the message they hear about seems to them to be a case where a Crazy guy with a gun holds it to humanity's head and demands worship or else.....

Thank you for explaining your point of view and for seeing the reason in mine.

[alanmolstad]

always happy to be of service....

[cheachea]

I know this is off topic a little bit, but I just wanted to say that I'm glad you are here God-free.

I also wanted to recommend some individuals you might find helpful/interesting.


* Dr. William Lane Craig: You might enjoy some of his debates.





* And Dr. Ravi Zacharias

[God-free]

Originally Posted by cheachea

I know this is off topic a little bit, but I just wanted to say that I'm glad you are here God-free.

I also wanted to recommend some individuals you might find helpful/interesting.


* Dr. William Lane Craig: You might enjoy some of his debates.





* And Dr. Ravi Zacharias

I watched the Craig/Hitchens video. I don't have time right now to indulge in Ravi Zacharias. Is there something about them that you wish to discuss?

[cheachea]

This is another person you might find interesting : Chris White.

[God-free]

Originally Posted by cheachea

This is another person you might find interesting : Chris White.

Does this video demonstrate Jesus as the son of God? Or, does it simply demonstrate that a man known as Jesus existed? I ask this because I don't necessarily deny that Jesus existed. I just don't believe he was a god or the son of a god.

Please post a separate thread if you wish to discuss this.

[God-free]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

always happy to be of service....

Just wanted you to know that I have posted a thread here about the Adam and Eve story.