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Thread: no need to restore the truth

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    Default no need to restore the truth

    Greetings,
    Paul wrote the following,
    “I marvel that you are turning away so soon from Him who called you in the grace of Christ, to a different gospel, which is not another; but there are some who trouble you and want to pervert the gospel of Christ. But even if we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel to you than what we have preached to you, let him be accursed. As we have said before, so now I say again, if anyone preaches any other gospel to you than what you have received, let him be accursed.” Gal 1:6-9
    The Gospel message preached by the Apostles and recorded in the New Testament was and is true and complete, and can be either accepted or rejected. There has never been a need for a "restored" gospel. I do not say this with disdain, as I am sure Joseph Smith was indeed searching for truth and you who are Mormons are sincere in your belief as I am in mine, but only one can be right. And since Joseph Smith seems to have done the exact thing Paul warned against, adding to a Gospel that was already complete and declared finished by Jesus Christ and receiving new information form an angel, wouldn't the New Testament account be more reliable than extra-biblical books added in the 1800's? The Gospel didn't need to be restored just preached.

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    Quote Originally Posted by childofgod View Post
    You should add "when we can just change the truth" to the title since that's what happened when different false doctrines were introduced like the trinity.
    Paul didn't say the Gospel wouldn't be lost. In fact, this was him foretelling of the Great Apostasy, something you don't believe in.
    Thanks for your reply. How can you cite what Paul "didn't say", he didn't say a lot of things. The Gospel preached by Paul was the one and only true Gospel and if you believe it was lost then you must also believe that God is inept and weak and Jesus died in vain, for many people surely perished waiting for Joseph Smith to restore what was lost. I understand your zeal to prove your beliefs are true, that is human nature but you are trusting the word of Joseph Smith and disregarding the word of Jesus Christ who proclaimed He was God.

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    Quote Originally Posted by childofgod View Post
    You should add "when we can just change the truth" to the title since that's what happened when different false doctrines were introduced like the trinity.
    Paul didn't say the Gospel wouldn't be lost. In fact, this was him foretelling of the Great Apostasy, something you don't believe in.
    Of course Paul NEVER foretold of any COMPLETE apostasy, any 'loss of the gospel,' or any need to 'restore' Christ's church that could never be lost.

    Do you REALLY BELIEVE that joe smith could invent a religion that could outlast what Jesus Christ HIMSELF built?

    HOW ARROGANT must smithy be? That he thought HE would do a 'better job of it' than Jesus (GOD) did?

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    Quote Originally Posted by childofgod View Post
    False. Jesus prophesied of the falling away too. Knowing the Great Apostasy happened doesn't mean we believe God can't do all things. It's simply the fact that man has changed the true gospel into a distorted version of it. The gospel of Jesus Christ is true, we deny the gospel that has been created through men's intervention. Doctrines such as the Trinity and ex niliho have been created by men, not taught by God, Jesus, or the prophets and apostles.
    Ok, let's put everything else aside except for this one thing, the deity of Christ. Jesus claimed to be equal with the Father, how can you ignore that and relegate Him to brother of Lucifer?

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    Quote Originally Posted by childofgod View Post
    This IS the church Jesus founded the same Jesus that is of the Bible. You have it backwards. Protestants keep believing that prophets, apostles, more scripture, modern revelation, temples aren't necessary even though they're part of God's order.
    Let's see now. . .just because YOU say it, we must believe in the fairytales of joe smith? Naah. You aren't that convincing.

    But unless you can show a COMPLETE apostasy from Christianity, SOME basis for joey smith's fallacious claim that we 'musta lost' some of our authority to speak/act for God, SOME basis for joey smith's fallacious claim that HIS RELIGION, STARTED IN THE EARLY 1830's IS the church Jesus Christ built in BIBLICAL TIMES, you have NOTHING TO OFFER ANYBODY.

    NOBODY needed to restore the TRUTH of GOD. GOD said IN SCRIPTURE,

    John 17:16-17
    17 Sanctify them by Your truth. Your word is truth.
    NKJV

    Even your false prophet joey smith acknowledged that the BIBLE is the Word of God (no 'translation problems here, btw, so you have no excuse). And we have every word of the BIBLE handy every day.

    Your made up modern-day prophets, apostles, more scripture, 'modern' revelation (that hasn't happened in over 75 years from your 'prophets' that can't prophesy, and temples, secret handshakes, magic underwear are nothing more than manmade fairytales. They were made up by joey smith. They were NOT in the first century church, the church JESUS CHRIST BUILT.

    Your heathen religion is an abomination to the REAL GOD. Your false gods, false christ, false religions, false writings such as the bom and book of abraham are all fantasies that you have been suckered to believe in.

    I am sorry for you. I will pray for your soul to the REAL GOD, the ONLY GOD EXTANT ANYWHERE, not the 'gods' that joey smith invented.

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    Quote Originally Posted by childofgod View Post
    You should add "when we can just change the truth" to the title since that's what happened when different false doctrines were introduced like the trinity.
    Paul didn't say the Gospel wouldn't be lost. In fact, this was him foretelling of the Great Apostasy, something you don't believe in.
    Your false prophet tried to 'just change the truth' when he wrote his fantasies including his fantasies about
    a god who was a man, but became a god, but was a god from all eternity to eternity
    a jesus who was popped out of the womb of a heavenly goddess along with a satan who is supposedly his 'spirit brother.'
    forever families
    marriage for eternity
    baptism for the dead
    temples for Christians
    secret temple rituals
    secret handshakes
    magical undeerwear
    etc
    etc
    etc

    When Paul talked a GREAT apostasy (which we certainly DO believe), he NEVER SAID ONE WORD about a COMPLETE apostasy. Paul never said ANYTHING wouldn't be lost. Not your car keys. Not your hat. Not the gospel. He didn't write to disprove things that WOULDN'T HAPPEN. He wrote about things that WOULD happen, that YOU seem not to believe. Stuff like:

    1 Peter 1:22-25
    22 Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, 23 having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, 24 because
    "All flesh is as grass,
    And all the glory of man as the flower of the grass.
    The grass withers,
    And its flower falls away,
    25 But the word of the Lord endures forever."

    Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you.
    NKJV

    Matt 24:24-25
    24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
    NKJV


    YOU seem to be deceived into thinking the gospel (which endures forever, from about 2,000 years ago, didn't 'get lost' or 'restored' at all) was lost to the church JESUS built.

    YOU seem to be deceived into thinking that your false prophet could do better than JESUS CHRIST (GOD) at building a church, one that would last forever.

    Sorry, but YOU have been suckered.

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    child posted:

    Originally Posted by disciple

    Thanks for your reply. How can you cite what Paul "didn't say", he didn't say a lot of things. The Gospel preached by Paul was the one and only true Gospel and if you believe it was lost then you must also believe that God is inept and weak and Jesus died in vain, for many people surely perished waiting for Joseph Smith to restore what was lost. I understand your zeal to prove your beliefs are true, that is human nature but you are trusting the word of Joseph Smith and disregarding the word of Jesus Christ who proclaimed He was God.
    False. Jesus prophesied of the falling away too. Knowing the Great Apostasy happened doesn't mean we believe God can't do all things. It's simply the fact that man has changed the true gospel into a distorted version of it. The gospel of Jesus Christ is true, we deny the gospel that has been created through men's intervention. Doctrines such as the Trinity and ex niliho have been created by men, not taught by God, Jesus, or the prophets and apostles.[/QUOTE]


    PLEASE SHOW US THE SCRIPTURE that says Jesus prophesied any great falling away by HIS CHURCH.

    INDIVIDUALS left.

    The Apostle John addressed that:

    1 John 2:19
    19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
    NKJV


    Those who left were NOT OF us at all. They were not CHRISTIANS.

    Of course you are AFRAID to address the GREAT APOSTASIES of the MORMONS. In less than 200 years there have been OVER 150 APOSTASIES in YOUR MORMON RELIGION. I can list them if you wish.

    Does THAT MEAN YOU LOST YOUR AUTHORITY TO ACT FOR GOD? DOES THAT MEAN YOUR SCRIPTURES GOT LOST?

    Yet you FALSELY CLAIM that is what happened in the church JESUS CHRIST BUILT. AND HE IS GOD. Joey smith built a MAN-made religion. And you are sucker for it!

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    Default You have been suckered by joey smith!

    child posted:

    Originally Posted by disciple

    Thanks for your reply. How can you cite what Paul "didn't say", he didn't say a lot of things. The Gospel preached by Paul was the one and only true Gospel and if you believe it was lost then you must also believe that God is inept and weak and Jesus died in vain, for many people surely perished waiting for Joseph Smith to restore what was lost. I understand your zeal to prove your beliefs are true, that is human nature but you are trusting the word of Joseph Smith and disregarding the word of Jesus Christ who proclaimed He was God.
    False. Jesus prophesied of the falling away too. Knowing the Great Apostasy happened doesn't mean we believe God can't do all things. It's simply the fact that man has changed the true gospel into a distorted version of it. The gospel of Jesus Christ is true, we deny the gospel that has been created through men's intervention. Doctrines such as the Trinity and ex niliho have been created by men, not taught by God, Jesus, or the prophets and apostles.[/QUOTE]


    PLEASE SHOW US THE SCRIPTURE that says Jesus prophesied any great falling away by HIS CHURCH.

    INDIVIDUALS left.

    The Apostle John addressed that:

    1 John 2:19
    19 They went out from us, but they were not of us; for if they had been of us, they would have continued with us; but they went out that they might be made manifest, that none of them were of us.
    NKJV


    Those who left were NOT OF us at all. They were not CHRISTIANS.

    Of course you are AFRAID to address the GREAT APOSTASIES of the MORMONS. In less than 200 years there have been OVER 150 APOSTASIES in YOUR MORMON RELIGION. I can list them if you wish.

    Does THAT MEAN YOU LOST YOUR AUTHORITY TO ACT FOR GOD? DOES THAT MEAN YOUR SCRIPTURES GOT LOST?

    Yet you FALSELY CLAIM that is what happened in the church JESUS CHRIST BUILT. AND HE IS GOD. Joey smith built a MAN-made religion. And you are sucker for it!

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    Ok, let's put everything else aside except for this one thing, the deity of Christ. Jesus claimed to be equal with the Father,
    so you are saying that the question "Did Jesus claim to be equal with His Father?" is the question to ask, and a person's answer (yes or no) to that question determines whether the person has the correct understanding of the deity of Christ.

    The LDS can answer "No" to the question, and can back up their answer by quoting Jesus, in the Bible, saying that His Father is greater than Jesus Himself is.

    Since your answer to the question is "yes" but you can't back up your answer by quoting Jesus, then you have a false understanding of the deity of Christ.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Phoenix View Post
    so you are saying that the question "Did Jesus claim to be equal with His Father?" is the question to ask, and a person's answer (yes or no) to that question determines whether the person has the correct understanding of the deity of Christ.

    The LDS can answer "No" to the question, and can back up their answer by quoting Jesus, in the Bible, saying that His Father is greater than Jesus Himself is.

    Since your answer to the question is "yes" but you can't back up your answer by quoting Jesus, then you have a false understanding of the deity of Christ.
    I don’t usually like to list so many references because people just don’t read them but these are relevant to my answer so I hope you will read them. Jesus openly and clearly assumed the prerogatives of deity. He claimed to have control over the eternal destinies of people (John 8:24; Luke 12:8-9; John 5:22, 27-29), to have authority over the divinely-ordained institution of the Sabbath (Matt. 12:8; Mark 2:28; Luke 6:5), to have the power to answer prayer (John 14:13-14; Acts 7:59; 9:10-17), and to have the right to receive worship and faith due to God alone (Matt. 21:16; John 14:1; John 5:23). He also assumed the ability to forgive sins (Mark 2:5-11)--something which, as His outraged opponents correctly understood, only God can do (v. 7).
    Jesus also called God's angels (Gen. 28:12; Luke 12:8-9; 15:10; John 1:51) His angels (Matt. 13:41; 24:30-31); God's elect (Luke 18:7; Rom. 8:33) His elect (Matt. 24:30-31); and God's kingdom (Matt. 12:28; 19:24; 21:31; Mark 1:15; Luke 4:43; John 3:3) His kingdom (Matt. 13:41; 16:28; Luke 1:33; 2 Tim. 4:1).
    In John 8:58 we read this,” Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” In John 20:28 Thomas refers to Jesus as “my Lord and my God” and he is not rebuked by Jesus.
    All of the above scripture shows that Jesus Christ claimed absolute equality with God. Thus He could say, "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30); "He who sees Me sees the One who sent Me" (John 12:45); and "He who has seen Me has seen the Father" (14:9-10). And thus we can conclude that "in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" (Col. 2:9), and we can worship Him accordingly as "our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus" (Titus 2:13). These are not mistakes or verses taken out of context but the truth of God’s word.

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    I don’t usually like to list so many references because people just don’t read them but these are relevant to my answer so I hope you will read them. Jesus openly and clearly assumed the prerogatives of deity. He claimed to have control over the eternal destinies of people (John 8:24; Luke 12:8-9; John 5:22, 27-29), to have authority over the divinely-ordained institution of the Sabbath (Matt. 12:8; Mark 2:28; Luke 6:5), to have the power to answer prayer (John 14:13-14; Acts 7:59; 9:10-17), and to have the right to receive worship and faith due to God alone (Matt. 21:16; John 14:1; John 5:23). He also assumed the ability to forgive sins (Mark 2:5-11)--something which, as His outraged opponents correctly understood, only God can do (v. 7).
    Jesus also called God's angels (Gen. 28:12; Luke 12:8-9; 15:10; John 1:51) His angels (Matt. 13:41; 24:30-31); God's elect (Luke 18:7; Rom. 8:33) His elect (Matt. 24:30-31); and God's kingdom (Matt. 12:28; 19:24; 21:31; Mark 1:15; Luke 4:43; John 3:3) His kingdom (Matt. 13:41; 16:28; Luke 1:33; 2 Tim. 4:1).
    In John 8:58 we read this,” Jesus said to them, “Most assuredly, I say to you, before Abraham was, I AM.” In John 20:28 Thomas refers to Jesus as “my Lord and my God” and he is not rebuked by Jesus.
    All of the above scripture shows that Jesus Christ claimed absolute equality with God. Thus He could say, "I and the Father are one" (John 10:30); "He who sees Me sees the One who sent Me" (John 12:45); and "He who has seen Me has seen the Father" (14:9-10). And thus we can conclude that "in Him dwells all the fullness of the Godhead bodily" (Col. 2:9), and we can worship Him accordingly as "our great God and Savior, Christ Jesus" (Titus 2:13). These are not mistakes or verses taken out of context but the truth of God’s word.
    You are right... I have no intention of reading any of your references. This is not because I am afraid to discover something that will make me lose my faith. It's because I have seen all these references before and can see right away you are all over the board; misapplying scripture, misinterpreting scripture, and bringing in scripture which has nothing to do with your point. This along with the many other logical fallacies I see you have employed just by scanning your post. Not the least of which is your "Shotgun argumentation" tactic.
    Ironically, the basic point you are trying to make has been torpedoed by your own follow up argument.

    Using your own reasoning....
    If the Jesus and the Father are "ONE" and therefore equal, then when Jesus tells us to become "ONE" with Him as He and the Father are "ONE" then that will make us EQUAL with God the Father.... Right?
    Last edited by theway; 06-23-2015 at 07:14 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by theway View Post
    You are right... I have no intention of reading any of your references. This is not because I am afraid to discover something that will make me lose my faith. It's because I have seen all these reference before and can see right away you are all over the board misapplying scripture, misinterpreting scripture, and bring in scripture which has nothing to do with your point. This along with the many other logical fallacies I see you have employed, just by scanning your post. Not the least of which is your "Shotgun argumentation" tactic.
    Ironically, the basic point you are trying to make has been torpedoed by your own follow up aurguement.

    Using your own conclusions, then....
    If we are to be "ONE" with the Son as the Father and Jesus are "ONE" then that will make use EQUAL with God the Father.... Right?
    Hello Way,
    I see you are your usual disrespectful self. But anyway why not just deal with a few verses like Titus 2:13. Titus under inspiration of the Holy Spirit called Jesus "our great God and Savior, did Titus make a mistake? What about the Prophet Isaiah he wrote under inspiration of the Holy Spirit "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." Are these fallacies?

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    Hello Way,
    I see you are your usual disrespectful self.
    As is.... You see, I don't pretend to be someone I am not.
    However I would not mock or ridicule someone for merely asking a question, only those that question.
    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    But anyway why not just deal with a few verses like Titus 2:13. Titus under inspiration of the Holy Spirit called Jesus "our great God and Savior, did Titus make a mistake? What about the Prophet Isaiah he wrote under inspiration of the Holy Spirit "For unto us a child is born, unto us a son is given: and the government shall be upon his shoulder: and his name shall be called Wonderful, Counseller, The mighty God, The everlasting Father, The Prince of Peace." Are these fallacies?
    First, I need you to be more specific on your premise.
    You said "under inspiration of the Holy Spirit"; I will need you to explain who exactly the Holy Spirit is?

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    Quote Originally Posted by theway View Post
    As is.... You see, I don't pretend to be someone I am not.
    However I would not mock or ridicule someone for merely asking a question, only those that question.
    First, I need you to be more specific on your premise.
    You said "under inspiration of the Holy Spirit"; I will need you to explain who exactly the Holy Spirit is?
    Do you think God would have you mock or ridicule someone who you believe needs to know the truth?

    The Holy Spirit of God as in 2 Peter 1:21,"For the prophecy came not in old time by the will of man: but holy men of God spoke as they were moved by the Holy Spirit." And who Jesus spoke of in John 14:26,"But the Helper, the Holy Spirit, whom the Father will send in My name, He will teach you all things, and bring to your remembrance all things that I said to you."

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    Do you think God would have you mock or ridicule someone who you believe needs to know the truth?
    Nope... That's why I said I will not mock someone who merely asks questions. However you are not doing that... You are questioning. Which means you are not interested in knowing the truth. You are only interested on trying to school us Mormons on your version of it.
    That being the case, I will continue to point out the obvious flaws, contradictions, and faulty logic of your "schooling"

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    Quote Originally Posted by theway View Post
    Nope... That's why I said I will not mock someone who merely asks questions. However you are not doing that... You are questioning. Which means you are not interested in knowing the truth. You are only interested on trying to school us Mormons on your version of it.
    That being the case, I will continue to point out the obvious flaws, contradictions, and faulty logic of your "schooling"
    But Way here's the thing, nothing I have posted is my opinion its what the Bible says and the Bible has no flaws or faulty logic.

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    Quote Originally Posted by childofgod View Post
    You didn't answer theway's question. He asked WHO the Holy Spirit is. We know the Holy Spirit is who inspired the prophets and whom Jesus sent, but who do you believe the Holy Spirit is? Characteristics.
    I too have seen all the references you've given and also know of your misuse of said scriptures. Modern Christianity teaches we will become gods while also denying that such a doctrine is true. Every Christian believes we can gain eternal life. God is eternal. To gain eternal life is to gain a life like God. If that is not eternal life, what do you believe it could possibly be?
    Listing references is great but useless if the person does so out of context. In your case, you just listed them with no context at all, you just plopped them all down on your post. We know how you understand these though as we have seen these used before.
    "The Father is greater than I." Jesus also said He keeps the commandments of the Father and doesn't do His own will but that of the Father.
    I didn't get an answer to why Jesus is referred to as great God in Titus 2:13 and The mighty God and The everlasting Father in Isaiah 9. Still waiting.

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    But Way here's the thing, nothing I have posted is my opinion its what the Bible says and the Bible has no flaws or faulty logic.
    No... It is not the Bible I have an issue with... It is your interpretation of it.
    If your interpretation of the Bible is the correct one, (assuming the Bible has no flaws in it) then you have just as much of a problem with your fellows Christian as you would with us.
    Before you think to school us, you need to go huddle up with other Christians first, to come up with only one interpretation you can all agree with.

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    Quote Originally Posted by theway View Post
    No... It is not the Bible I have an issue with... It is your interpretation of it.
    If your interpretation of the Bible is the correct one, (assuming the Bible has no flaws in it) then you have just as much of a problem with your fellows Christian as you would with us.
    Before you think to school us, you need to go huddle up with other Christians first, to come up with only one interpretation you can all agree with.
    You got it all wrong Way, I'm not trying to "school" you or anyone else. This is still a free county and you have the right to believe anything you want without me degrading or criticizing your integrity. I know you are sincere in your belief, I'm just trying to understand why you believe things I don't see in the Bible and for that matter why the Bible was not enough. The Gospel of Jesus Christ was being preached a very long time before Joseph Smith came on the scene, do you believe that all those people who read and believed the Bible and the testimony concerning Jesus had wrong information?

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    You got it all wrong Way, I'm not trying to "school" you or anyone else. This is still a free county and you have the right to believe anything you want without me degrading or criticizing your integrity. I know you are sincere in your belief, I'm just trying to understand why you believe things I don't see in the Bible and for that matter why the Bible was not enough.
    Oh please.... If you were only after an understanding of what we believe, then you would not be telling us we are wrong, nor would you be offering your opinion. You then claim you are not here to criticize, yet all anyone has to do is go back over your posts to see that all you do is criticize us and our beliefs.
    At least I'm honest about why I am here, you can not even own up to your own intentions.

    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    The Gospel of Jesus Christ was being preached a very long time before Joseph Smith came on the scene, do you believe that all those people who read and believed the Bible and the testimony concerning Jesus had wrong information?
    Yes and no, depends on what information you are talking about.

    But then that's an odd question coming from you as you believe Christains throughout the ages got it wrong on many issues

    For example, which do you believe?
    Water Baptism a requirement... Yes or no?
    Faith Alone for salvation... Yes or no?
    Priesthood authority how is it given?
    This is just three small questions, yet no matter how you answer, somebody within the Christian community got it wrong, if not everybody.
    Last edited by theway; 06-23-2015 at 01:35 PM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by theway View Post
    Oh please.... If you were only after an understanding of what we believe, then you would not be telling us we are wrong, nor would you be offering your opinion. You then claim you are not here to criticize, yet all anyone has to do is go back over your posts to see that all you do is criticize us and our beliefs.
    At least I'm honest about why I am here, you can not even own up to your own intentions.
    Ok Way, just trying to be respectful. I'm guessing your not one of the guys going door to door, your not real personable. My intention is to have a discussion and that's pretty much it.

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    Ok Way, just trying to be respectful. I'm guessing your not one of the guys going door to door, your not real personable. My intention is to have a discussion and that's pretty much it.
    Quite the contrary... I'm very nice and respectful, just not to Pretenders who are trying to sell me doctrine I know is trash, or try to tell me what it is I really believe.
    If you really wanted a discussion, then why not start by answering my question to your assertion.
    You stated that the verse which said that Jesus and the Father are one, mean that they were "equal" I.e. One and the same person. If true, then how do you reconcile the verse which tells us we are to be one with Christ the same way Christ is one with The Father? Are you implying we are equal to the Father?... .I won't even go into the verses which say Christ is eternally subordinate to the Father and what that means to you.

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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    I don’t usually like to list so many references because people just don’t read them but these are relevant to my answer so I hope you will read them.
    Yes, they are relevant to your answer, but they are not the same thing as an answer. You said that Jesus claimed to be equal with His Father, and I said that Jesus claimed that His Father is greater. Can we both be right? I don't think so. I think I am right, and if we can't both be right, then you must be wrong.

    Did Jesus claim to know the hour and minute of His Second Coming? yes/no
    Did Jesus claim that only His Father knows such a thing? yes/no

    Right there you have lost this debate. And, using your rules for accusing someone of having a false understanding of the deity of Christ, this means that you have a false understanding of the deity of Christ. Sorry to be the one to have to tell you.

  24. #24
    Senior Member disciple's Avatar
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    Hello Phoenix, Way and Cog,

    Thanks for your reply's. I guess I could answer your post's using scripture but we all know what would happen; my answers would be called trash, heresy and false doctrine and I get that, that's what you believe. Everything I say is either out of context, accusatory or a lie. Ok I guess we all think that about people who believe different than we do. So how about you guys tell me something I don't know about what you believe. I would like to know how you believe people were saved before Joseph Smith. How did God get the truth to people between 33AD and 1830? Serious question.

  25. #25
    Senior Member disciple's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by childofgod View Post
    This:
    ... doesn't answer anything. It is nothing but a list of random scriptures. I may as well copy and paste the entire Topical Guide. Explanations you give come because of traditional looks at them, not by the Holy Ghost. The Holy Ghost has never testified to ideas such as the trinity, ex niliho, the idea of being sinners when we are born, etc.
    New Age Christianity says its heresy to become like God yet you claim Jesus is equal to the Father and Christ prays for us to be one in Him as He is in the Father. Your own doctrines contradict one another. People did not have all of the truth during the Great Apostasy because it didn't exist. Amos prophesied of this when he said there would be a time when the word of God would not be found anywhere.
    Here's a question for you, have you asked God if the Book of Mormon is true?
    Come on Cog, how did people get saved between 33AD and 1830? Can you answer or not, all you do is tell me how wrong I am but you never tell me why you are right.

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