Mormons are 'christians. . .' they follow 'a' christ.

[Christian]

Not the BIBLICAL Jesus Christ, but 'a' jesus christ. . .a spirit-brother-of-satan 'jesus' that joseph smith invented.

But because they follow SOMEONE or SOMETHING calling itself 'jesus christ,' they are 'by definition' 'christians.'

[theway]

Originally Posted by Christian

Not the BIBLICAL Jesus Christ, but 'a' jesus christ. . .a spirit-brother-of-satan 'jesus' that joseph smith invented.

But because they follow SOMEONE or SOMETHING calling itself 'jesus christ,' they are 'by definition' 'christians.'

I follow the Jesus Christ that is in the Bible, is yours a different Jesus Christ than that???

[chuckt]

Originally Posted by theway

I follow the Jesus Christ that is in the Bible, is yours a different Jesus Christ than that???

Who is Jesus to you? I'm not putting you on the spot and you can have a lot of time to answer this question.

[chuckt]

Originally Posted by theway

I follow the Jesus Christ that is in the Bible, is yours a different Jesus Christ than that???

Who is Jesus to you? I'm not putting you on the spot and you can have a lot of time to answer this question.

[Phoenix]

Originally Posted by chuckt

Who is Jesus to you? I'm not putting you on the spot and you can have a lot of time to answer this question.

I like Peter's answer to that question when Jesus asked it of him. I agree with Peter.

[Christian]

Originally Posted by theway

I follow the Jesus Christ that is in the Bible, is yours a different Jesus Christ than that???

If you are a mormon, YOURS is a different Jesus Christ than that. If you DO follow the Jesus Christ of the Bible, you are NOT a mormon. SIMPLE. . .

joey smith INVENTED mormonism, INVENTED his own 'jesus christ' who is supposedly a 'spirit-brother-of-satan,' but IS NOT THE JESUS CHRIST OF THE BIBLE. If you follow HIS 'jesus' then you are NOT following the Jesus Christ of the Bible. . .you are only giving Him 'lip service' while following joey smith's INVENTIONS.

[Christian]

Originally Posted by Phoenix

I like Peter's answer to that question when Jesus asked it of him. I agree with Peter.

WHICH Peter? Peter Pan? Belief in a false christ (a spirit brother of satan) instead of the REAL Christ (the ONLY begotten [fathered]) Son of God means that whatever 'peter' you are talking about must have answered your IMAGINARY jesus. . .

[dberrie2000]

Originally Posted by Christian

Not the BIBLICAL Jesus Christ, but 'a' jesus christ. .

Would that be this Jesus Christ?

Matthew 7:19-21---King James Version (KJV)
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Why do the faith alone preach a salvation through a faith without works?

What one finds in the Bible--is also found in the LDS church.

[Christian]

Originally Posted by theway

I follow the Jesus Christ that is in the Bible, is yours a different Jesus Christ than that???

Are you telling us that you do NOT follow the smith-invented 'christ?'

The BIBLICAL Jesus is the ONLY begotten (fathered) Son of God (John 3:16), not one of the many illegitmate sons of joe smith's invention.

[Christian]

cog posted:

Originally Posted by Christian
If you are a mormon, YOURS is a different Jesus Christ than that. If you DO follow the Jesus Christ of the Bible, you are NOT a mormon. SIMPLE. . .

joey smith INVENTED mormonism, INVENTED his own 'jesus christ' who is supposedly a 'spirit-brother-of-satan,' but IS NOT THE JESUS CHRIST OF THE BIBLE. If you follow HIS 'jesus' then you are NOT following the Jesus Christ of the Bible. . .you are only giving Him 'lip service' while following joey smith's INVENTIONS

.

Which means I could say if you believe in the Jesus Christ of the Bible then you cannot be anything but a Mormon.

How stupid is that?

Same logic you're using. I follow the only Jesus Christ there enough has ever been, not some imaginary being taught through the trinity because some people with no real understanding of the scriptures, and no other.

IF you follow joey smith's INVENTED "jesus" then you follow a FALSE christ, one of supposedly MANY 'begotten' (definition, 'FATHERED') spirit babies according to joey smith's religion.

The REAL Jesus (the BIBLICAL Jesus Christ) is God's ONLY begotten (fathered) Son. See John 3:16, then tell us why you consider God to be a liar there.

According to GOD:

Isa 43:10-11
10 "You are My witnesses," says the Lord,
"And My servant whom I have chosen,
That you may know and believe Me,
And understand that I am He.
Before Me there was no God formed,
Nor shall there be after Me.
11 I, even I, am the Lord,
And besides Me there is no savior.
NKJV

Isa 44:6
6 "Thus says the Lord, the King of Israel,
And his Redeemer, the Lord of hosts:
'I am the First and I am the Last;
Besides Me there is no God.
NKJV

Isa 44:8
8 Do not fear, nor be afraid;
Have I not told you from that time, and declared it?
You are My witnesses.
Is there a God besides Me?
Indeed there is no other Rock;
I know not one.'"
NKJV
There are many more, but those three pretty well sum it up. Joey smith's 'gods' of your pgp book of Abraham, chapters 3 and 4 are FALSE GODS. The God of the BIBLE says HE is the ONLY ONE, NONE besides Him exist, HE DOESN'T EVEN KNOW OF ANY OTHER GODS.

Your 'prophet' lied to you.





You don't get to go around saying "You believe in the wrong Jesus" to everyone and act like you follow Jesus.
O course I do. I believe the REAL Jesus. The jesuses of mormonism, christian scientism, and other made-up jesuses ARE the wrong ones.

And since I actually DO follow the REAL Jesus Christ, I SHOULD act like it. And I do.

Talking to you gets nobody anywhere because you're too close minded to believe anyone but blind trinitarians are Christians.

So if we UNDERSTAND that the BIBLE SAYS that the Father is God, Jesus is God, the Holy Spirit is God (and OF COURSE IT DOES SAY THOSE THINGS) AND that there is ONLY ONE GOD ANYWHERE, then we must be 'blind' if we refer to that BIBLICAL CONCEPT as 'trinity?'

SHOW ME BIBLICALLY where I have stated ANY UNTRUTH about the nature of God in the above paragraph. Personally I don't think you can FIND ONE SCRIPTURE that disagrees with ONE WORD OF IT.

You have been lied to by your cult again, it appears. . .

Yes, I AM close-minded. I BELIEVE what God has said in the Bible. I BELIEVE that the Bible is the TRUTH. I don't think it is WRONG to BELIEVE THE TRUTH.

YOU are as close-minded as I am. YOU believe joey smith's fables. YOU believe in the mormon gods and prophets who haven't been able to prophesy since when????About 1911?

You've never done a real study of the scriptures, by real I mean with the Holy Ghost

Only for about 42+ years out of the last 50 years have I had the Holy Ghost teaching me. Prior to that I was NOT a believer.

But the Holy Ghost has made DRASTIC changes in my life. I am not the man I once was, a swearing, angry, short-fused, evil man.

Instead my life is characterized by the FRUIT OF THE HOLY GHOST. If you knew ANY of the folks who knew me before I became a Christian and who know me now, you would know the stupidity of your claim.

If you had, you wouldn't behave the way you do. Being a Biblical Christian that I am, I find you to be a disgrace to Protestants everywhere.

Your unBIBLICAL opinion is noted. But you should be aware that is ALL it is, nothing more.


You even ignore any verse we give from the Bible just because we're mormons.

No, I have not. Please SHOW US ONE SCRIPTURE from the Bible I have ignored (chapter and verse) or ADMIT YOU ARE NOT TELLING THE TRUTH.

You've been proven wrong with every single issue, doctrine, and piece of history on this site. You have embarr***ed yourself and keep inviting the spirit of contention, a spirit from Satan.

Both are totally FALSE CLAIMS. Please SHOW US ONE SINGLE ISSUE OR DOCTRINE I have erred in (CHAPTER AND VERSE IN THE BIBLE, of course) or ADMIT YOU ARE NOT TELLING THE TRUTH. I don't think you can find even ONE that I have been BIBLICALLY wrong in, and I know you are NOT telling the truth.

I challenge you to PUT UP OR ADMIT YOUR FALSEHOODS.

So far you have found NOTHING AT ALL of any "spirit from Satan" in ANY of my posts. What you have seen is what the pharisees and sadducees saw when JESUS and PAUL and others attacked THEIR FALSE TEACHINGS.

But then, neither you nor them should expect to 'feel good' about being proven defrauded by joey smith and satan's minions. . .

[Christian]

Originally Posted by dberrie2000

Would that be this Jesus Christ?

Matthew 7:19-21---King James Version (KJV)
19 Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire.
20 Wherefore by their fruits ye shall know them.
21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Why do the faith alone preach a salvation through a faith without works?

What one finds in the Bible--is also found in the LDS church.

Just enough truth and half-truths to make it "look like" it legitimizes your false religion. There are the same kinds of claims by branch davidians, catholics, and white supremecists. PARTIAL truths to make it 'look like' your cult is from God to those who don't read more than just a little bit of your religion's garbage' The TRUTH is that your cult (like those others) takes SOME of the truth, REDEFINE SOME OF IT, ADD your own garbage, then pretend it is all 'from God.'

Of course the fantasies of joey smith are still nothing more than the fantasies of joey smith. Those who 'believe in' those fantasies will be led to Hell.

[Christian]

I notice they can come up with NO LEGITIMATE ARGUMENT against what I said. . .

[Grandma]

Originally Posted by childofgod

...Yet, we know who we worship...

Do you worship the Holy Spirit?

[Grandma]

Originally Posted by childofgod

We worship He whom we are to worship: the Father. We do so in Jesus Christ's name and by the power of the Holy Ghost.

According to Mormonism, Jesus is God of this world. You should worship Him. According to Mormonism, Jehovah/Jesus said, Thou shalt have no other Gods before me. (Ex. 20:3)


In Christian Love,

Grandma

[Christian]

Originally Posted by childofgod

We've given quotes, statistics from polls showing that Mormons as a whole know more about the Bible than any Protestant, have given verses from scriptures, explained the scriptures given, including the ones you've given, and have overall topped you in every topic thus far. You repeat yourself all the time. Its always "You believe in a false Christ. Your Christ was invented by Smith" blah blah blah. Yet, we know who we worship. We worship the Father through the Jesus Christ of the Bible. You've gone so far as to say the God of the Bible isn't our God even though He, not It, is.

And I have demonstrated that your so-called 'statistics from polls' were not valid at all. You have not given one single scripture that says your 'daddy god who fathers all them 'spirit babies' exists at all, OR that Jesus was only one of MANY 'begotten' (fathered) by the REAL GOD.

The BIBLE refutes you when it says Jesus is the ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF GOD (John 3:16).

Your cult has lied to you, and you 'know' it is telling the truth.

Nobody can convince you of the GODLY truth. . .you prefer the darkness of smith's lies.

BTW, CHRISTIANS have been repeating ourselves for about 2,000 years now. Mormons didn't come close to existing when we began.

[Grandma]

Originally Posted by childofgod

Begotten means offspring. Jesus is literally the offspring of the Father while He is the Father of our spirits. Sorry but we agree with the Bible.
You've demonstrated a poor knowledge, that's it.

Begotten doesn't always mean offspring --- especially in Mormonism.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by childofgod

Begotten means offspring. Jesus is literally the offspring of the Father while He is the Father of our spirits. Sorry but we agree with the Bible.
You've demonstrated a poor knowledge, that's it.

Yes, it was my understanding that begotten - meaning to have brought (a child) into existence, and that He was the only begotten in the flesh, meaning He is the ONLY physical being that has an earthly mother and a Heavenly Father in his physical DNA. But God is the Father of all of our spirits. Do they not believe that?? This is fascinating, I had no idea, He's always referred to as Our Father, so...

[Grandma]

Originally Posted by childofgod

Yes it does
be·get
\bi-ˈget, bē-\
verb
: to cause (something) to happen or exist
: to become the father of (someone)
Full Definition
be·got\-ˈgät\ also be·gat\-ˈgat\be·got·ten\-ˈgä-tən\ or be·gotbe·get·ting
transitive verb
1 :to procreate as the father
2 :to produce especially as an effect or outgrowth

It does not always mean offspring.

Originally Posted by childofgod

An outgrowth is something grown out of something else. Jesus Christ is literally the offspring of God. That is what the Bible testifies of. If you don't believe we're all children of God I piety you and you would have no business calling Him Father.

To be born. To beget is to give birth, to procreate, or to call into being. In the scriptures, these words are often used to mean being born of God. Although Jesus Christ is the only child begotten of the Father in mortality, all people may be spiritually begotten of Christ by accepting him, obeying his commandments, and becoming new persons through the power of the Holy Ghost.
Guide to the Scriptures, lds.org

Mosiah 5:7
And now, because of the covenant which ye have made ye shall be called the children of Christ, his sons, and his daughters; for behold, this day he hath spiritually begotten you; for ye say that your hearts are changed through faith on his name; therefore, ye are born of him and have become his sons and his daughters.

Are you the spirit child of Elohim or of Jesus Christ?

Love in Christ,

Grandma

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by Grandma

Begotten doesn't always mean offspring --- .

What is taught is that Jesus is "begotten not made"

we know from an example in the Bible that a person can have many children, yet call only one of his children the "Only begotten"...

[Christian]

Originally Posted by childofgod

Begotten means offspring. Jesus is literally the offspring of the Father while He is the Father of our spirits. Sorry but we agree with the Bible.
You've demonstrated a poor knowledge, that's it.

You are wrong once again. You have demonstrated your own self-contradictions.


JESUS is the ONLY begotten Son of God (John 3:16), NOT ONE OF MANY offsprings.

And YOUR 'father god' is supposedly the 'father' of YOUR 'jesus' and YOUR 'satan' spirit babies. Now EXACTLY WHAT PART DO I HAVE WRONG?

[Grandma]

Originally Posted by childofgod

What am I wrong about? Jesus being the only begotten Son of God means He's the only literal, physical, offspring of God. We are not born spiritual orphans. Everyone, Christian and atheist alike, is a child of God. If you think we're born as spiritual orphans then you would have to believe that an infant who p***es away would be doomed to ****ation if not baptized or brought under the trinitarian umbrella. This belief would put you on par with catholicism.
You keep criticizing the church of the Lamb to no avail. My faith in God is stronger than your influence which comes from Lucifer. The umbrella I'm under is the divine protection given by Christ, through the scriptures and prayer, that no amount of false doctrines or criticisms can pierce.

There are many begotten sons.

D&C 76
24 That by him, and through him, and of him, the worlds are and were created, and the inhabitants thereof are begotten sons and daughters unto God.

Mosiah 5
7 And now, because of the covenant which ye have made ye shall be called the children of Christ, his sons, and his daughters; for behold, this day he hath spiritually begotten you; for ye say that your hearts are changed through faith on his name; therefore, ye are born of him and have become his sons and his daughters.

In Christian Love,

Grandma

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by Grandma

There are many begotten sons.

D&C 76
24 That by him, and through him, and of him, the worlds are and were created, and the inhabitants thereof are begotten sons and daughters unto God.

Mosiah 5
7 And now, because of the covenant which ye have made ye shall be called the children of Christ, his sons, and his daughters; for behold, this day he hath spiritually begotten you; for ye say that your hearts are changed through faith on his name; therefore, ye are born of him and have become his sons and his daughters.

In Christian Love,

Grandma

There are times when the word "begotten" is used symbolically when referring to Christ

Mosiah 5:7 And now, because of the covenant which ye have made ye shall be called the children of Christ, his sons, and his daughters; for behold, this day he hath spiritually begotten you; for ye say that your hearts are changed through faith on his name; therefore, ye are born of him and have become his sons and his daughters.

In this case, like I noted before when referring to Jesus Christ as "Father" we are "spiritually begotten" meaning you are his "spiritual children" unto his gospel and "growing up" to be like him, through faith and baptism.


So we are literally begotten spirits of God
Symbolically begotten sons & daughters of Jesus Christ through faith and covenants

But Christ is still the ONLY begotten son of God in the flesh on this earth. The ONLY mortal being with a Heavenly Father and a mortal mother.

[Christian]

cog posted:

What am I wrong about? Jesus being the only begotten Son of God means He's the only literal, physical, offspring of God.

When it says 'His ONLY begotten Son. . .' the word 'begotten' simply means 'fathered.' Nothing about 'physical' at all. Just 'fathered or 'begotten''

We are not born spiritual orphans. Everyone, Christian and atheist alike, is a child of God.

Not true. GOD said:

John 8:44
44 You are of your father the devil, and the desires of your father you want to do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and does not stand in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaks a lie, he speaks from his own resources, for he is a liar and the father of it.
NKJV

It looks like you make your stuff up as you go, and it CONFLICTS with what GOD has already revealed. NON-Christians are NOT children of God. IF THEY WERE, they would NOT have to be ADOPTED into Christ's family when we became CHRISTIANS. But JESUS BOUGHT US. HE paid the price. No such payment would have been required if we had already been 'spirit children' of God.

joey smith lied to you.


If you think we're born as spiritual orphans then you would have to believe that an infant who p***es away would be doomed to ****ation if not baptized or brought under the trinitarian umbrella. This belief would put you on par with catholicism.
Of course we CHRISTIANS don't believe that nonsense, so you are simply spitting in the wind. . . with NOTHING FROM SCRIPTURE to support you. . . as usual.

You keep criticizing the church of the Lamb to no avail.

I have NEVER ONCE criticized CHRIST'S church. I HAVE criticized MANY of your cults however.

I <snipped> your personal attack. It had no substance.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by Christian

cog posted:

What am I wrong about? Jesus being the only begotten Son of God means He's the only literal, physical, offspring of God.

When it says 'His ONLY begotten Son. . .' the word 'begotten' simply means 'fathered.' Nothing about 'physical' at all. Just 'fathered or 'begotten''

We are not born spiritual orphans. Everyone, Christian and atheist alike, is a child of God.

t looks like you make your stuff up as you go, and it CONFLICTS with what GOD has already revealed. NON-Christians are NOT children of God. IF THEY WERE, they would NOT have to be ADOPTED into Christ's family when we became CHRISTIANS. But JESUS BOUGHT US. HE paid the price. No such payment would have been required if we had already been 'spirit children' of God.

If you think we're born as spiritual orphans then you would have to believe that an infant who p***es away would be doomed to ****ation if not baptized or brought under the trinitarian umbrella. This belief would put you on par with catholicism.
Of course we CHRISTIANS don't believe that nonsense, so you are simply spitting in the wind. . . with NOTHING FROM SCRIPTURE to support you. . . as usual.

The scriptures use different terms to describe how we are sons & daughters of God & Jesus Christ

We are all literal spirit children of Heavenly Father
Acts 17:29 - We are offspring of God
Hebrews 12:9 - Be in subjection unto the Father of spirits

We are "adopted" children born again through the Atonement
John 1:12 - As many as received himgave he power to become the sons of God

I know it can be confusing, but the Bible does use words in multiple ways .... For example

The word "glory"
Splendor - Matthew 6:29 "....Solomon in all his glory..."
Praise - Acts 12:23 "...he did not give God the glory..."
Brightness - 2Corinthians 3:7 "the glory of Moses's face"
Heaven - 1Timothy 3:16 "...taken up in glory..."

As for the last comment above from you, I don't see how you could believe any other way if you think we can only be adopted children of God through faith in the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and that only the sons and daughters of God will live with Him again. By that, your logic would dictate that children not brought unto the Gospel cannot live with God, or is there a concession made in that case? If so, up to what age do children get a p***?

I snipped your scripture from John as I did not see the relevance to the conversation, unless you were noting another example of when the word "father" is used....very good, I see you are aware of multiple uses for individual words

[Christian]

mickey posted:

The scriptures use different terms to describe how we are sons & daughters of God & Jesus Christ

We are all literal spirit children of Heavenly Father
Acts 17:29 - We are offspring of God

Adopted, of course. . .He is CLEARLY NOT TALKING about 'spiritual babies, popped out of goddesses impregnated by your 'daddy-god'

Hebrews 12:9 - Be in subjection unto the Father of spirits

We are "adopted" children born again through the Atonement
John 1:12 - As many as received him gave he power to become the sons of God

Which OF COURSE indicates that they are GIVEN THE POWER TO BECOME the sons of God, THEY AREN'T THAT WAY BEFORE THEN. The Atonement of JESUS CHRIST (THE REAL ONE) paid for them

I know it can be confusing, but the Bible does use words in multiple ways .... For example

The word "glory"
Splendor - Matthew 6:29 "....Solomon in all his glory..."
Praise - Acts 12:23 "...he did not give God the glory..."
Brightness - 2Corinthians 3:7 "the glory of Moses's face"
Heaven - 1Timothy 3:16 "...taken up in glory..."

Sorry, but your 1 Timothy p***age says no such thing. IT says:

1 Tim 3:16
16 And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness:


God was manifested in the flesh,
Justified in the Spirit,
Seen by angels,
Preached among the Gentiles,
Believed on in the world,
Received up in glory.
NKJV

Jesus was received up in glory alright, but NOT "INTO" glory. He was taken up in SPLENDER, and BEAUTY (Glory)

NOT up into 'exaltation' places or into 'one of three places you could go when you die.'

Joey smith made all THAT junk up out of the air.

Your claim that it is referring to heaven is bogus.

As for the last comment above from you, I don't see how you could believe any other way if you think we can only be adopted children of God through faith in the Gospel of Jesus Christ, and that only the sons and daughters of God will live with Him again.

I'm glad you agree with my understanding.

By that, your logic would dictate that children not brought unto the Gospel cannot live with God, or is there a concession made in that case? If so, up to what age do children get a p***?

God has given NO 'age of consent,' thus when Jesus said 'of such is the kingdom of heaven' we don't know when in a child's life that ceases to be. Your theory about my logic is flawed, to say the least