A Christmas Poem for Mormons

[Apologette]

'Twas the Night Before Smithmas!

'Twas the night before Smithmas, and all through the temple,
Not a cumelon was creeping, or a tapir, (for ex-emple!)
The garments were hung out to dry in the air,
But fortunately for us, we have two extra pairs.

The children were stashed at Gramma's homestead,
While Mom and Pop got dunked once again for the dead!
And Mom in her veil, and I in my white cap,
Had just about finished another endowment wrap!

When beyond the temple grounds I heard a big clatter
Even sprang from my seat to see about the chatter;
To the pentagram window I flew like an eagle,
Peered out to see some Christians - they were legal!

The icky tall towers cast a shadow below
But still I could see someone I did know.
For what to unbelieving eyes should appear,
But my eldest daughter and hubby, my greatest fear!

With signs held high, walking about and about
And above the din, I could even hear them shout!
Rapidly, quickly, their sentences came,
And they shouted each "profit", yes even by name!

"Now Smith, now Young, now Kimball and Monson!
Come on Woodruff, and Taylor, and every man's son!
To the top of the temple, to the top of the spire!
Each man can explain why he did conspire"!

"Joseph Lied"! They shouted as the leaves began to fly,
We've met the Tanners, and discovered the lies!
So come out and face us, bring the whole crew!
Hinckley and "Fielding," and McConkie, too!

And then in a while, I perceived on the roof!
That Moroni was laughing, banging his hoof!
And as I turned back to check my dear wife,
I saw her run crying, "getting out with my life."

The wiggling hand dropped from the eerie veil,
And soon the whole crowd ran out, 'cept the frail!
Some hobbled along, they didn't look back,
'Til there was just me, and Satan in black!

Old Slew Foot's eyes flashed, as he called after the flee-ers
"Ha, you fools won't escape, you can't be "believers."
You see, you've covenanted Joe Smith to obey,
If you don't, why then fools, I'll rule the day!

But the stump of one sign still stood on it's pole,
And it's words could be seen, even thru the cold!
"Joseph has lied, no first vision , he's a boaster!
Moronoi never existed, and Smith's an impostor!

The Christians rejoiced as the Mormons streamed out,
And I couldn't help hearing them put up a shout!
With a smile and a prayer, they welcomed the lost,
And told them the Gospel, Good News in the frost!

And they spoke God's Word, going straight to their work,
Filling hearts with hope, and healing the hurt!
They p***ed out Bibles, and with tears in their eyes,
Praised the God of the Universe, who vanquishes lies!

And with hope's spark in my heart, I ran out to see,
My family who cared to love, love mother and me!
And I heard them exclaim, as they prayed so intense!
"Good bye Joseph Smith, and to Satan, get thee hence"!

[alanmolstad]

hey,,,,,look who woke up!

[MickeyS]

Thank you for reaffirming to me the true purpose of this forum that others are too gutless to admit, and that is to demean and belittle others. There is no grand purpose here, no Christ like behavior...and I don't know if this was "Doc" Marty's intentions but if it was then this scripture that Alan posted from Matthew "20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them" says a lot about Marty and his "ministry".

[Christian]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

Thank you for reaffirming to me the true purpose of this forum that others are too gutless to admit, and that is to demean and belittle others. There is no grand purpose here, no Christ like behavior...and I don't know if this was "Doc" Marty's intentions but if it was then this scripture that Alan posted from Matthew "20 Therefore by their fruits you will know them" says a lot about Marty and his "ministry".

At least marty and his ministry don't routinely send HIS followers to hell like joe smith has.

Mock Jesus Christ and us his followers all you want. In the end, you will have to face Him. . . I will continue to pray for your soul.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by Christian

At least marty and his ministry don't routinely send HIS followers to hell like joe smith has.

Mock Jesus Christ and us his followers all you want. In the end, you will have to face Him. . . I will continue to pray for your soul.

I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm not going to hell, I'm really not. I do take offense at you saying I mock my Savior Jesus Christ. He saved my life and has changed me into an infinitely better person than I was or ever thought I could be. Through Him I can work through any struggle, affliction or obstacle I encounter. He HEALS me both mind and spirit every single day. I thank Him every single night and I love Him with all my heart. And He absolutely knows that. I know I cannot do anything without Him.

[Christian]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm not going to hell, I'm really not. I do take offense at you saying I mock my Savior Jesus Christ. He saved my life and has changed me into an infinitely better person than I was or ever thought I could be. Through Him I can work through any struggle, affliction or obstacle I encounter. He HEALS me both mind and spirit every single day. I thank Him every single night and I love Him with all my heart. And He absolutely knows that. I know I cannot do anything without Him.

And when you die and meet Him, will you recognize Him? How will you respond when you realize He is NOT the jesus-spirit-brother-of-satan that your false prophet invented?

My guess would be that your struggles and need for healing is not worse than my own, and the Jesus of the Bible Whom I serve has saved my physical life multiple times, saved my soul, changed me into HIS child and often unworthy servant. HE has brought me through such physical damage to my body that I should have died several times, but HE answers the prayers of my wife and friends as well as myself. I live every day in physical pain, but HE sees me through in peace and love. HE has provided me with my every need.

All the Glory goes to the God of the Bible, not to joe smith's manmade inventions.

I sincerely hope you will recognize Him when you see Him.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by Christian

And when you die and meet Him, will you recognize Him? How will you respond when you realize He is NOT the jesus-spirit-brother-of-satan that your false prophet invented?

My guess would be that your struggles and need for healing is not worse than my own, and the Jesus of the Bible Whom I serve has saved my physical life multiple times, saved my soul, changed me into HIS child and often unworthy servant. HE has brought me through such physical damage to my body that I should have died several times, but HE answers the prayers of my wife and friends as well as myself. I live every day in physical pain, but HE sees me through in peace and love. HE has provided me with my every need.

All the Glory goes to the God of the Bible, not to joe smith's manmade inventions.

I sincerely hope you will recognize Him when you see Him.

I never in a millions years implied that The Saviors grace and Gods love have not touched your life or that the prayers of your wife have not been answered many times on your behalf, I believe they have. The faithful prayers of my mother pulled me out of a deadly drug addicted lifestyle and even being caught in crossfire from a drug raid between my then boyfriend (who then took his life) and the police. Nobody can explain how I did not catch one of those bullets as I was standing directly between him and the task force officers as they exchanged fire.

I do know you have faith in God and His Son Jesus Christ. I am concerned on your behalf that your spiteful negative feelings towards others may cloud your judgments, it's just an observation. I struggle with negativity myself and I have to remember on a daily basis that we are all God's children who are deserving of His love, why else would Christ have given the new commandment to love one another? Not just certain people....ALL people.

You are absolutely right though, one day we will all stand before Him, and I am always striving to keep my life in line with His teachings (I will be the first to admit I fall short some days and that has been apparent in my dealings here from time to time, I simply can't allow myself to do that) and I will not fear that day. And we will ALL recognize Him when we see Him, as it states in Phillipians chapter 2. Why will we recognize Him? Because we all already know Him.

I know you don't believe me and I know that you never will. I feel bad for you, I do, because you have actually been lied to, and will never realize it. You follow man's interpretation of God's Word as well....you do. Even your study of hermeneutics was created by man. You cannot show me ONE thing you believe that hasn't p***ed through the translation &/or interpretation of man. It all comes from what MAN has done with it. So for you to give me man made interpretations of scripture doesn't mean it came directly from God. It really doesn't. And I don't want to go into any more Bible verses with you either, because I went into great detail to explain my examples from the OT on another comment and you disregarded them. And if you addressed them, you would only use your man made techniques and interpretations anyway, and round and round we go. We're both in the same boat...we'll just have to wait and see who's destination we arrive at. I know all will be revealed.

You can ridicule me and what I say all you want, and that's fine too, it doesn't do anything to me, it can't hurt me, the more you ridicule a person the only one you truly hurt is yourself, I know that from experience as well. So that being said, I really need to take a break from this place again, if I'm honestly trying to love my fellow man, I will not be back, because that's not happening here from anyone.

Merry Christmas to you Christian, I'll pray for you as well.

[alanmolstad]

http://www.bobbrooke.com/WritersCorn...swhentouse.htm



In this age we have to understand the great chance that the person who is attempting to read our posts on this message forum, is doing so while on their cell phone.

Ever try to real a huge wad of text on a smart phone?

thus.....we need to always understand as well that we need to make our posts easy to read...

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

I never in a millions years implied that The Saviors grace and Gods love have not touched your life or that the prayers of your wife have not been answered many times on your behalf, I believe they have.

The faithful prayers of my mother pulled me out of a deadly drug addicted lifestyle and even being caught in crossfire from a drug raid between my then boyfriend (who then took his life) and the police.
Nobody can explain how I did not catch one of those bullets as I was standing directly between him and the task force officers as they exchanged fire.

I do know you have faith in God and His Son Jesus Christ.
I am concerned on your behalf that your spiteful negative feelings towards others may cloud your judgments, it's just an observation.

I struggle with negativity myself and I have to remember on a daily basis that we are all God's children who are deserving of His love, why else would Christ have given the new commandment to love one another?
Not just certain people....ALL people.

You are absolutely right, one day we will all stand before Him, and I am always striving to keep my life in line with His teachings (I will be the first to admit I fall short some days and that has been apparent in my dealings here from time to time, I simply can't allow myself to do that) and I will not fear that day.
And we will ALL recognize Him when we see Him, as it states in Phillipians chapter 2. Why will we recognize Him? Because we all already know Him.

I know you don't believe me and I know that you never will.
I feel bad for you, I do, because you have actually been lied to, and will never realize it.
You follow man's interpretation of God's Word as well....you do.
Even your study of hermeneutics was created by man.
You cannot show me ONE thing you believe that hasn't p***ed through the translation &/or interpretation of man.
It all comes from what MAN has done with it.

So for you to give me man made interpretations of scripture doesn't mean it came directly from God.
It really doesn't.
And I don't want to go into any more Bible verses with you either, because I went into great detail to explain my examples from the OT on another comment and you disregarded them.
And if you addressed them, you would only use your man made techniques and interpretations anyway, and round and round we go.

We're both in the same boat...we'll just have to wait and see who's destination we arrive at.
I know all will be revealed.
You can ridicule me and what I say all you want, and that's fine too, it doesn't do anything to me, it can't hurt me, the more you ridicule a person the only one you truly hurt is yourself, I know that from experience as well.
So that being said, I really need to take a break from this place again, if I'm honestly trying to love my fellow man, I will not be back, because that's not happening here from anyone.

Merry Christmas to you Christian, I'll pray for you as well.

It's just more easy for me to read and follow along this way...

[MickeyS]

Oh good grief Alan....forgive me for not formatting my response correctly....you are something else, you know. I sit here and try to convey what I'm feeling, get my sincere intentions out there, all while on my lunch break during an extremely busy day at the flower shop, promise myself I'm going to do my best to treat people better....and then you come along. Man....you test every fiber of my being to be loving to my fellow man. sigh... That's why I need to stay away from this place.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

It's just more easy for me to read and follow along this way...

I don't care what your link says, you disjointed my thoughts. I was sharing my experience about my mothers prayers because of what I said about Christians wife's prayers. I don't understand why you broke my section about the gospel and the bible up so much, that all was a cohesive thought. I broke it out better than I had it, but not as much as you did, you ripped my thoughts to pieces and "re-ordered" them "correctly" even though that's not necessarily how I meant them, thank you for deciding my intentions and inflections for me. Plus you just effectively diminished everything I was trying to say in the process.

I can't believe you ignore everything I have to say until you can take the chance to try to make me feel stupid, I only had a few minutes to express myself and I was on a phone as well. Do you know how hard it is to get all this out on a phone, especially with the glitches this site has every time I try to correct something??

You know what? Do whatever you want to make it easier for you to read, I wasn't even directing it towards you, and I'm not sure why it even matters, you don't regard anything I say anyway. I can't help but think you just like to take any chance to make people feel stupid or small, and I can only imagine what you must get out of that. This place is poison.

My prayer for the people here is that you maybe re-evaluate what it is you are trying to accomplish with the way you communicate with others and if it truly is how God would want you to behave, especially since you claim to be doing all this in His name. I have, and it's not, I have stooped to belittling as well, and I for one do not feel good about it, and I know it's wrong. But it's hard not to fall into that with the atmosphere that's been created within this forum. I'm sorry you're so caught up in whatever it is you think you're doing to see that, I feel bad for you.

The Spirit will NOT abide among such pettiness, again, I have been quite guilty of it myself.
I don't care how "safe" you feel within the folds of Christ's grace, you would be extremely naive to believe nothing you do can jeopardize your connection with The Lord and His Spirit.

I will pray for you as well...and for me...

[alanmolstad]

No good turn...

[Christian]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

I never in a millions years implied that The Saviors grace and Gods love have not touched your life or that the prayers of your wife have not been answered many times on your behalf, I believe they have. The faithful prayers of my mother pulled me out of a deadly drug addicted lifestyle and even being caught in crossfire from a drug raid between my then boyfriend (who then took his life) and the police. Nobody can explain how I did not catch one of those bullets as I was standing directly between him and the task force officers as they exchanged fire.

I do know you have faith in God and His Son Jesus Christ. I am concerned on your behalf that your spiteful negative feelings towards others may cloud your judgments, it's just an observation. I struggle with negativity myself and I have to remember on a daily basis that we are all God's children who are deserving of His love, why else would Christ have given the new commandment to love one another? Not just certain people....ALL people.

You are absolutely right though, one day we will all stand before Him, and I am always striving to keep my life in line with His teachings (I will be the first to admit I fall short some days and that has been apparent in my dealings here from time to time, I simply can't allow myself to do that) and I will not fear that day. And we will ALL recognize Him when we see Him, as it states in Phillipians chapter 2. Why will we recognize Him? Because we all already know Him.

I know you don't believe me and I know that you never will. I feel bad for you, I do, because you have actually been lied to, and will never realize it. You follow man's interpretation of God's Word as well....you do. Even your study of hermeneutics was created by man. You cannot show me ONE thing you believe that hasn't p***ed through the translation &/or interpretation of man. It all comes from what MAN has done with it. So for you to give me man made interpretations of scripture doesn't mean it came directly from God. It really doesn't. And I don't want to go into any more Bible verses with you either, because I went into great detail to explain my examples from the OT on another comment and you disregarded them. And if you addressed them, you would only use your man made techniques and interpretations anyway, and round and round we go. We're both in the same boat...we'll just have to wait and see who's destination we arrive at. I know all will be revealed.

You can ridicule me and what I say all you want, and that's fine too, it doesn't do anything to me, it can't hurt me, the more you ridicule a person the only one you truly hurt is yourself, I know that from experience as well. So that being said, I really need to take a break from this place again, if I'm honestly trying to love my fellow man, I will not be back, because that's not happening here from anyone.

Merry Christmas to you Christian, I'll pray for you as well.

I think you miss the obvious. It is not YOU I ridicule, it is what you have been badly taught. It is the evil system that has been foisted upon you in place of the REAL Jesus Christ and HIS church.

Joe smith's religion didn't exist until he INVENTED IT in the 1830's. Yes, I know you don't believe that. But you cannot find ANY of the mormon-specific junk documented by ANYONE in the first century church, and much if not most of the mormon-specific junk simply flies in the face of what the Bible really teaches. But if you carry enough baggage into your mormon 'studies,' you get to keep your momon junk.

I have not been lied to. I have depended SOLELY upon what the Bible SAYS for my understanding of God and His Kingdom. I don't have to depend upon any manmade books, bishoprics or on man to understand SCRIPTURE. And if you want to denigrate Scripture, you are on your own. The BIBLE is the Word of God. Your bom, d&c, and pgp and other junk is just junk added in the 1800's.

Your so-called 'modern-day revelation' ended over a hundred years ago. . .not one new 'revelation' has been added to your d&c since then. NONE of your 'modern-day-revelators' has had any 'revelations' for over a hundred years. You cannot document even one.

Merry Christmas to you too. I continue to pray for your soul and hope that one day you will find the TRUTH.

Meanwhile, you don't need to worry about me. . .I have Jesus, the Love of God, love for my neighbor, and eternal life with God when I die. I would wish the same for you.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by Christian

I think you miss the obvious. It is not YOU I ridicule, it is what you have been badly taught. It is the evil system that has been foisted upon you in place of the REAL Jesus Christ and HIS church.

Joe smith's religion didn't exist until he INVENTED IT in the 1830's. Yes, I know you don't believe that. But you cannot find ANY of the mormon-specific junk documented by ANYONE in the first century church, and much if not most of the mormon-specific junk simply flies in the face of what the Bible really teaches. But if you carry enough baggage into your mormon 'studies,' you get to keep your momon junk.

I have not been lied to. I have depended SOLELY upon what the Bible SAYS for my understanding of God and His Kingdom. I don't have to depend upon any manmade books, bishoprics or on man to understand SCRIPTURE. And if you want to denigrate Scripture, you are on your own. The BIBLE is the Word of God. Your bom, d&c, and pgp and other junk is just junk added in the 1800's.

Your so-called 'modern-day revelation' ended over a hundred years ago. . .not one new 'revelation' has been added to your d&c since then. NONE of your 'modern-day-revelators' has had any 'revelations' for over a hundred years. You cannot document even one.

Merry Christmas to you too. I continue to pray for your soul and hope that one day you will find the TRUTH.

Meanwhile, you don't need to worry about me. . .I have Jesus, the Love of God, love for my neighbor, and eternal life with God when I die. I would wish the same for you.

So you claim to have created hermeneutics yourself and knew absolutely nothing about the "doctrine" of the trinity before you read the Bible and have relied on absolutely no other source of information to aid you in your learning? How did you know to call it the "trinity" since that word is mentioned nowhere in the Bible. You can't say you haven't ever been dependent on the study and interpretation of other men in your studies. Please provide proof that the specific "doctrine" of the trinity was taught in the 1st century either. You have your interpretation of a couple bible verses when there are more in contrast saying the opposite. Again, I'm not getting into it. And as far as the restoration only being around for a couple hundred years, what did the Jews say when Christ came and pointed out all the misconceptions and incorrect doctrine THEY were teaching? I'm sure they felt a lot like you are feeling right now and we're absolutely sure they were right. They didn't even recognize him for who He was. It's not like this exact thing hasn't happened before. Anyway, i dont think you're understanding what I'm saying. That's ok, take care.

I have ONE sincere question. Do you truly believe you're showing love to others here in your conversations? Because it's really really hard to see, I just wonder if you understand that or if you believe we're just not worthy of the love Christ spoke of? Anyway, it's always been s question I had. But answer it or not, I'll try to stay away

[Christian]

mickey posted:

So you claim to have created hermeneutics yourself and knew absolutely nothing about the "doctrine" of the trinity before you read the Bible and have relied on absolutely no other source of information to aid you in your learning? How did you know to call it the "trinity" since that word is mentioned nowhere in the Bible. You can't say you haven't ever been dependent on the study and interpretation of other men in your studies.

Do you make this stuff up as you go? I never made any such claims, and YOU KNOW IT. Trying to 'put words into my mouth' is DISHONEST, so please stop trying to do that. I have not said I have not heard or seen others discussing such things. . .I simply said they are not my SOURCE OF UNDERSTANDING

Please provide proof that the specific "doctrine" of the trinity was taught in the 1st century either. You have your interpretation of a couple bible verses when there are more in contrast saying the opposite.

Why are mormons always trying to tear down the Bible? God does NOT contradict Himself. The BIBLE CLEARLY SHOWS that
The FATHER is God
JESUS is God
THE HOLY SPIRIT is God
and
THEY ARE ONE GOD (not multiple Gods) (see Isaiah 43:10, 44:6, 44:8 etc etc etc)

THAT IS WHAT I REFER TO when I refer to the TRINITY (that BIBLICAL stuff from about 2,000 years ago)

That WAS taught in the first century church.

Judaism and Christianity HAVE ALWAYS BEEN MONO-theistic. Joseph smith's religion teaches POLYTHEISTIC. It teaches a pantheon of gods, and that you can become one. (Wasn't that the first temptation, the one that satan posed to Eve in the garden of Eden?)

Again, I'm not getting into it.

EXACTLY WHAT are you not getting into?

And as far as the restoration only being around for a couple hundred years, what did the Jews say when Christ came and pointed out all the misconceptions and incorrect doctrine THEY were teaching?

Let's see now. . .Jesus got all over some of them for making 'rules' or 'ordinances' that didn't come from God at all, just like the mormon religion does. . .

I'm sure they felt a lot like you are feeling right now and we're absolutely sure they were right. They didn't even recognize him for who He was.

Yet I DO recognize Jesus and I love and serve Him every day of my life. It is your 'spirit-brother-of-satan' that your "prophet" described I don't want anything to do with.


It's not like this exact thing hasn't happened before. Anyway, i dont think you're understanding what I'm saying. That's ok, take care

I understand you clearly. Yep heathens have been mocking us CHRISTIANS for about 2,000 years now. . .you mormons and your behavior are nothing new to us.

I have ONE sincere question. Do you truly believe you're showing love to others here in your conversations? Because it's really really hard to see, I just wonder if you understand that

Would you rather I refer to your religious leaders as a bunch of whitewashed tombs, full of rotting bones? That is how Jesus referred to folks like them.

or if you believe we're just not worthy of the love Christ spoke of?

Nope, I have never believed that. I post to you in the same manner as you post to me. You are a lot like a pot calling a kettle black.

[MickeyS]

Christian....did you or did you not state that you rely on NOTHING that is manmade and further that that you depend SOLELY on the Bible, and haven't relied upon man to understand anything? You may want to go ahead and re-read what you said and re-word it if it is not what you meant. Because as you stated it, you rely on NOTHING by man...which would be hermeneutical study of the Bible, the trinity "doctrine".. etc... The Bible did not come with a hermeneutical study guide written by the apostles directly from God or a special section on the trinity, again directly from God...you have had to rely upon the teachings of man to learn such things. But you say you have not, and then call me a liar for pointing it out. If that's not what you meant, maybe you shouldn't have said it. Because it is EXACTLY what you said, word for word.

And please don't act like you're treating me like I treat you. I want to be nice to you Christian, I truly do, I want to do all I can to show love to my fellow man, especially you, but it's very difficult here, I try to look at it from your angle....etc...and no matter how polite I try to be, you continue treating me like I'm something you s****ed off your shoe. If you would, please show me anywhere in my response where I showed rude, flippant, disrespectful abusive behavior. Please. All I have done is disagree with you, and point out the things that you have said. I have used no disrespectful language, I have not resorted to belittling name calling and ad hominem attacks So, no, I'm sorry, I haven't. And you know that. So I'm not sure you answered my question. But if you would, point out the insults and I will be the first to apologize.

[Phoenix]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm not going to hell, I'm really not. I do take offense at you saying I mock my Savior Jesus Christ. He saved my life and has changed me into an infinitely better person than I was or ever thought I could be. Through Him I can work through any struggle, affliction or obstacle I encounter. He HEALS me both mind and spirit every single day. I thank Him every single night and I love Him with all my heart. And He absolutely knows that. I know I cannot do anything without Him.

Amen. I, too, believe that if it hadn't been for what Christ has done in my life, I would be a much worse person than I am.

[Christian]

mickey posted:

Christian....did you or did you not state that you rely on NOTHING that is manmade and further that that you depend SOLELY on the Bible, and haven't relied upon man to understand anything?

HERE is EXACTLY what I posted:

I have not been lied to. I have depended SOLELY upon what the Bible SAYS for my understanding of God and His Kingdom. I don't have to depend upon any manmade books, bishoprics or on man to understand SCRIPTURE. And if you want to denigrate Scripture, you are on your own. The BIBLE is the Word of God. Your bom, d&c, and pgp and other junk is just junk added in the 1800's.

NOT ONE WORD about not 'relying' on ANYTHING that is manmade. BIBLES are printed by men, and as you can see I depend SOLELY upon the Bible for my beliefs and practices. NOT the words of false prophets, the writings of heathens such as the bom, d&c, and pgp and other mormon junk.

You may want to go ahead and re-read what you said and re-word it if it is not what you meant. Because as you stated it, you rely on NOTHING by man...which would be hermeneutical study of the Bible, the trinity "doctrine".. etc...

ONLY INSIDE YOUR OWN HEAD which is obviously biased because of your apriori beliefs.

The Bible did not come with a hermeneutical study guide written by the apostles directly from God or a special section on the trinity, again directly from God...you have had to rely upon the teachings of man to learn such things. But you say you have not, and then call me a liar for pointing it out.

You have left out TWO IMPORTANT INGREDIENTS, the BIBLE and the HOLY SPIRIT. GOD'S WORD, the Bible SPEAKS to Christians. . .we understand most of what we read. The Holy Spirit helps us. THAT IS EVERYTHING WE NEED. We don't need the opinions of false prophets, liars, conmen, or criminals such as joseph smith.

If that's not what you meant, maybe you shouldn't have said it. Because it is EXACTLY what you said, word for word.

FALSE, what I cut-and-pasted above is EXACTLY what I said, word for word. NOTHING AT ALL about "nothing that is manmade" as all.

And please don't act like you're treating me like I treat you. I want to be nice to you Christian, I truly do, I want to do all I can to show love to my fellow man, especially you, but it's very difficult here,

There is always a 'but,' isn't there? An excuse why something isn't quite as you represent it to be.

Things ARE often difficult here, and I think we BOTH fall short at times. Don't try to be 'politically correct' or 'nice' with me. Simply be truthful and try to be accurate and concise in what you say. I will try to do likewise, and perhaps we can communicate better.

I will however, continue to disrespect joseph smith and the mormon religion, both of which are heretical and evil. Satan comes disguised as an angel of light, the Bible tells us.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by Christian

NOT ONE WORD about not 'relying' on ANYTHING that is manmade. BIBLES are printed by men, and as you can see I depend SOLELY upon the Bible for my beliefs and practices.

Sigh, ok Christian, than before I misunderstand anything else you're saying, do you rely upon the teachings of the trinity, and how did you learn about that? You had to have learned it specifically outside of the Bible because it's never mentioned by name in the Bible. YOU SAID " I don't have to depend upon any manmade books, bishoprics or on man to understand SCRIPTURE." Yet you obviously use the teachings of man to understand scripture and THAT is what I was talking about, I think you know exactly what I meant. You use manmade techniques to study scripture and manmade doctrine like the trinity. So again to say you rely SOLELY on the Bible is inaccurate. Again if it is not what you meant, why did you say it? Please let me know. Actually, you don't need to let me know. You rely on the teachings of men, I rely on the teachings of men. We both claim to be led by the Spirit. We are in the same boat Christian, it was the only point I was making. One day we will all know as all will be revealed, so again, going around and around with this benefits no one. But, that's fine Christian, carry on.

BTW...it's not being politically correct to be nice to you, it's called being "Christlike". I don't want to be nice to you because of what you or others would think of me, I want to be nice to show my love because that's what Christ wants me to do and that's what Christ WOULD do. Even if HE chose to reprove or correct others, He expects US to turn the other cheek. It's up to Him who He forgives or judges, it is up to US to love one another. That's what I really want to work on more. That's why I'm going to do all I can not to come around, ok? Grrrr...stupid pride

[Christian]

mickey posted:

Originally Posted by Christian
NOT ONE WORD about not 'relying' on ANYTHING that is manmade. BIBLES are printed by men, and as you can see I depend SOLELY upon the Bible for my beliefs and practices.

Sigh, ok Christian, than before I misunderstand anything else you're saying, do you rely upon the teachings of the trinity, and how did you learn about that?

I know FROM THE BIBLE that
The Father is God
Jesus is God
The Holy Spirit is God

There is only ONE GOD ANYWHERE (Isa 43:10, 44:6, 44:8 etc etc etc etc

I don't need the writings of false prophets to show me that.

You had to have learned it specifically outside of the Bible because it's never mentioned by name in the Bible.

Not by name, BUY BY CONCEPT.

YOU SAID " I don't have to depend upon any manmade books, bishoprics or on man to understand SCRIPTURE." Yet you obviously use the teachings of man to understand scripture and THAT is what I was talking about, I think you know exactly what I meant.

Let's see. . .No, I don't have to depend upon your false prophets or their writings or their organizations to understand what GOD said in the Bible.

You use manmade techniques to study scripture and manmade doctrine like the trinity.

The concept of the Trinity is scriptural. I have shown so above.

How many gods do YOU believe exist? According to the SCRIPTURE listed above the GOD OF THE BIBLE DOESN'T KNOW OF ANY.

So again to say you rely SOLELY on the Bible is inaccurate.

Only in your mind.

Again if it is not what you meant, why did you say it? Please let me know.

I said it because it is what I meant. You may try to TWIST it if you wish, nobody can stop you. Be aware though, that such TWISTING amounts to lying. . .

Actually, you don't need to let me know. You rely on the teachings of men,

So you don't think the BIBLE (what I DO rely on) is inspired by God? It is only 'the teachings of men?' I guess you are what Paul talked to the Corinthians about:

1 Cor 2:14-15
14 But the natural man does not receive the things of the Spirit of God, for they are foolishness to him; nor can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
NKJV

I rely on the teachings of men. We both claim to be led by the Spirit. We are in the same boat Christian, it was the only point I was making.

Yet we are not. I am in the Historical Christian 'boat,' you are in the 'newby boat,' invented by joseph smith. The boat I am on is headed to a sweet sunset. The one you are on is floating down the creek towards a waterfall (disaster) and you don't even have a paddle.

One day we will all know as all will be revealed, so again, going around and around with this benefits no one. But, that's fine Christian, carry on.

Yep, you are spiritually dead, stuck in a religion invented by joe smith.

BTW...it's not being politically correct to be nice to you, it's called being "Christlike". I don't want to be nice to you because of what you or others would think of me, I want to be nice to show my love because that's what Christ wants me to do and that's what Christ WOULD do.

It is politically correct for you to claim that. You cannot show one single scripture that says you should 'be nice' to anyone. You are to be patient, kind (telling the TRUTH that you are headed to hell is NOT unkind), and loving. My posts are that way.

HERE is how we are supposed to be:

2 Tim 4:1-5
2 Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.
NKJV


John the Baptist wasn't wrong in HIS impolite behavior either:

Matt 3:7-12
7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming to his baptism, he said to them, "Brood of vipers! Who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? 8 Therefore bear fruits worthy of repentance, 9 and do not think to say to yourselves, 'We have Abraham as our father.' For I say to you that God is able to raise up children to Abraham from these stones. 10 And even now the ax is laid to the root of the trees. Therefore every tree which does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. 11 I indeed baptize you with water unto repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, whose sandals I am not worthy to carry. He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. 12 His winnowing fan is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clean out His threshing floor, and gather His wheat into the barn; but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."
NKJV

His words (like my own) sounded harsh, but were meant for good. He was not 'politically' correct, but he did not 'play nicey-nice' with them either.

Even if HE chose to reprove or correct others, He expects US to turn the other cheek.

I do that with you daily. I do both.

It's up to Him who He forgives or judges,

He already forgave me. He paid the price for my sins about 2,000 years ago on a cross.

it is up to US to love one another.

It is not UNloving for me to show you that you are going the wrong way, even if it makes you mad at me.

It is a little like seeing your house on fire and me banging on your door, waking you up to tell you.

It is also exactly what Paul told Timothy to do:

2 Tim 4:1-5
2 Preach the word! Be ready in season and out of season. Convince, rebuke, exhort, with all longsuffering and teaching. 3 For the time will come when they will not endure sound doctrine, but according to their own desires, because they have itching ears, they will heap up for themselves teachers; 4 and they will turn their ears away from the truth, and be turned aside to fables.
NKJV

You have turned aside to the fables invented by joseph smith. They are not from God; and you cannot demonstrate from SCRIPTURE that they are.

I will continue to show you the SCRIPTURES that demonstrate joe smith's foibles for what they are.

[Apologette]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

I appreciate the sentiment, but I'm not going to hell, I'm really not. I do take offense at you saying I mock my Savior Jesus Christ. He saved my life and has changed me into an infinitely better person than I was or ever thought I could be. Through Him I can work through any struggle, affliction or obstacle I encounter. He HEALS me both mind and spirit every single day. I thank Him every single night and I love Him with all my heart. And He absolutely knows that. I know I cannot do anything without Him.

Lucifer's brother won't save you, pal, and in fact the Mormon Jesus is nothing but a figment of your imagination. Read the Bible.

[Apologette]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

Christian....did you or did you not state that you rely on NOTHING that is manmade and further that that you depend SOLELY on the Bible, and haven't relied upon man to understand anything? You may want to go ahead and re-read what you said and re-word it if it is not what you meant. Because as you stated it, you rely on NOTHING by man...which would be hermeneutical study of the Bible, the trinity "doctrine".. etc... The Bible did not come with a hermeneutical study guide written by the apostles directly from God or a special section on the trinity, again directly from God...you have had to rely upon the teachings of man to learn such things. But you say you have not, and then call me a liar for pointing it out. If that's not what you meant, maybe you shouldn't have said it. Because it is EXACTLY what you said, word for word.

And please don't act like you're treating me like I treat you. I want to be nice to you Christian, I truly do, I want to do all I can to show love to my fellow man, especially you, but it's very difficult here, I try to look at it from your angle....etc...and no matter how polite I try to be, you continue treating me like I'm something you s****ed off your shoe. If you would, please show me anywhere in my response where I showed rude, flippant, disrespectful abusive behavior. Please. All I have done is disagree with you, and point out the things that you have said. I have used no disrespectful language, I have not resorted to belittling name calling and ad hominem attacks So, no, I'm sorry, I haven't. And you know that. So I'm not sure you answered my question. But if you would, point out the insults and I will be the first to apologize.

And you are an authority on the Bible? If you even understood Genesis 1 you wouldn't be following a pedophile prophet who said he'd be your "god," and now is.

[Erundur]

Originally Posted by Apologette

Lucifer's brother won't save you, pal, and in fact the Mormon Jesus is nothing but a figment of your imagination. Read the Bible.

As Christians, we disagree with you and proclaim that Jesus Christ does, in fact, exist.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by Apologette

Lucifer's brother won't save you, pal, and in fact the Mormon Jesus is nothing but a figment of your imagination. Read the Bible.

"Pal"?? Whaa???

[alanmolstad]

"pal" = A friend; a chum...