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Thread: What do you think people must DO to be saved?

  1. #1
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    Default What do you think people must DO to be saved?

    My Bible tells me:

    Eph 2:8-9
    8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
    NKJV

    If Faith is NOT of works, then HOW CAN YOUR GOOD WORKS "help God" save you from the penalty of your sins?
    There is one poster here who is 'stuck' on the idea that doing good works (KEEPING the commandments, DOING STUFF) must happen IN ORDER TO BE SAVED.

    My Bible (GOD through HIS WORD) does NOT SAY THAT.

    Comments?

  2. #2
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    My Bible tells me:

    Eph 2:8-9
    8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
    NKJV
    [COLOR=#0000cd]
    If Faith is NOT of works, then HOW CAN YOUR GOOD WORKS "help God" save you from the penalty of your sins?
    Did these "help God" to be saved from their sins?

    Acts 2:38---King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    There is one poster here who is 'stuck' on the idea that doing good works (KEEPING the commandments, DOING STUFF) must happen IN ORDER TO BE SAVED.
    Was Jesus stuck on keeping the commandments?

    Matthew 19:16-19---King James Version (KJV)
    16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
    17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
    19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    Was John?

    1 John 2:3-4---King James Version (KJV)
    3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
    4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

    My Bible (GOD through HIS WORD) does NOT SAY THAT.
    Yes--your Bible connects keeping the commandments with eternal life:

    Revelation 22:14---King James Version (KJV)
    14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    1 Corinthians 7:19--King James Version (KJV)
    19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

  3. #3
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    Matthew 19:16-19---King James Version (KJV)
    16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
    17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
    19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    .....]
    I see you still cant get yourself to quote the rest of the story there.....

    Must be so hard for you to always need to edit the word of God you quote to make it agree with your views....

  4. #4
    dberrie2000
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    Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post

    Matthew 19:16-19---King James Version (KJV)
    16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
    17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
    19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.
    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    I see you still cant get yourself to quote the rest of the story there..... Must be so hard for you to always need to edit the word of God you quote to make it agree with your views....
    A couple of questions:

    1) What do you believe quoting the "rest of the story"--will do to cover up or cancel out what Christ did testify to, IE--

    Matthew 19:16-19---King James Version (KJV)
    16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
    17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
    19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    Or, IOW--

    1 John 2:3-4King James Version (KJV)
    3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
    4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

    2) What do you find as quoting scriptures to be an "edit the word of God"?

  5. #5
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    A couple of questions:

    1) What do you believe quoting the "rest of the story"--will do to cover up or cancel out what Christ did testify to, IE--

    Matthew 19:16-19---King James Version (KJV)
    16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
    17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
    19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    Or, IOW--

    1 John 2:3-4King James Version (KJV)
    3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
    4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

    2) What do you find as quoting scriptures to be an "edit the word of God"?
    I see you still run and hide from quoting the rest of the story....


    so sad.....



    It must be such a worry for you, knowing that the moment you correctly quote a bible story your views are made to look rather foolish.

  6. #6
    dberrie2000
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    Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post A couple of questions:

    1) What do you believe quoting the "rest of the story"--will do to cover up or cancel out what Christ did testify to, IE--

    Matthew 19:16-19---King James Version (KJV)
    16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
    17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
    19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    Or, IOW--

    1 John 2:3-4King James Version (KJV)
    3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
    4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.

    2) What do you find as quoting scriptures to be an "edit the word of God"?
    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    I see you still run and hide from quoting the rest of the story....
    I'm not of the opinion that quoting the "rest of the story" somehow covers up or cancels out what the Savior testified to above. Are you?

    Alan--please do make your case, but the--- taint so!!!--retorts are neither convincing nor compelling.

  7. #7
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    berry posted:


    Originally Posted by Christian
    [COLOR=#333333]My Bible tells me:

    Eph 2:8-9
    8 For by grace you have been saved through faith, and that not of yourselves; it is the gift of God, 9 not of works, lest anyone should boast.
    NKJV

    If Faith is NOT of works, then HOW CAN YOUR GOOD WORKS "help God" save you from the penalty of your sins?
    Did these "help God" to be saved from their sins?

    Acts 2:38---King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    WHY DO YOU THINK they were baptized? They ALREADY BELIEVED and were SAVED. The word 'for' that you hilighted is a translation of a Greek word that means 'because of' and is translated that way in other places as well.

    They were SAVED BY FAITH, THEN they repented and were baptized BECAUSE OF the remission of their sins.

    Of course, YOU SEEM TO THINK that 'salvation' includes the resurrection of those folks headed for ****ation. SOME 'salvation,' huh?


    Was Jesus stuck on keeping the commandments?

    WE CHRISTIANS KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. . .BOTH OF THEM.

    UNLESS YOU worship on SA****AYS, your cult does NOT KEEP THE COMMANDMENT TO KEEP THE SABBATH HOLY.

    Do YOU require YOUR MEN TO BE CIRCUMCISED? THAT TOO WAS AN OT COMMANDMENT that YOUR CULT does NOT KEEP.


    Matthew 19:16-19---King James Version (KJV)
    16 And, behold, one came and said unto him, Good Master, what good thing shall I do, that I may have eternal life?
    17 And he said unto him, Why callest thou me good? there is none good but one, that is, God: but if thou wilt enter into life, keep the commandments.
    18 He saith unto him, Which? Jesus said, Thou shalt do no murder, Thou shalt not commit adultery, Thou shalt not steal, Thou shalt not bear false witness,
    19 Honour thy father and thy mother: and, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself.

    Was John?

    1 John 2:3-4---King James Version (KJV)
    3 And hereby we do know that we know him, if we keep his commandments.
    4 He that saith, I know him, and keepeth not his commandments, is a liar, and the truth is not in him.


    Answered many times before. Pointed out to you that the man was UNDER THE OT LAW, instructed by a JEW UNDER THE OT LAW (Jesus had not yet been crucified and resurrected). NEITHER was under the NEW TESTAMENT OF JESUS CHRIST.


    Yes--your Bible connects keeping the commandments with eternal life:

    Revelation 22:14---King James Version (KJV)
    14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city.

    1 Corinthians 7:19--King James Version (KJV)
    19 Circumcision is nothing, and uncircumcision is nothing, but the keeping of the commandments of God.

    AS I POITED OUT ABOVE. . .WE CHRISTIANS KEEP HIS COMMANDMENTS. . .BOTH OF THEM. . .we LOVE GOD and we LOVE OUR NEIGHBORS.

    NOT a bunch of man-made 'ordinances' such as your fake 'baptism for the dead,' 'endowments,' etc etc etc

  8. #8
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    [COLOR=#0000cd] WHY DO YOU THINK they were baptized? They ALREADY BELIEVED and were SAVED.
    So--you believe they were saved prior to the remission of sins?

    Acts 2:38---King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

  9. #9
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    The word 'for' that you hilighted is a translation of a Greek word that means 'because of' and is translated that way in other places as well.
    Please feel free to show us any translation which uses "because of" in Acts2:38:

    Acts 2:38---King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    They were SAVED BY FAITH,
    In the Christian Bible--one is saved by God;s grace.

    So--what is there about repentance and water baptism you don't consider a work-and what is there about the remission of sins you don't consider God's grace?

    Acts2:38--God's grace for our obedience to His work.

  10. #10
    alanmolstad
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    the moment a person becomes saved is when they turn to the Lord and believe.

    This moment can happen at many different times.

    But it's always by grace though faith, and not by works.

  11. #11
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    I'm not of the opinion that quoting the "rest of the story" .......
    ...haha... ....so silly...


    You should copy/past that statement as an example of "Running in fear" of the truth....

  12. #12
    alanmolstad
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    the moment a person becomes saved is when they turn to the Lord and believe.

    This moment can happen at many different times.

    But it's always by grace though faith, and not by works.
    You mean you don't have to get baptized?....nope


    You mean you don't have to do a lot of keeping the commandments...nope


    You mean you don't have to strap-on super secret undies?.......nope.




    The only thing that matters on this question is too keep in mind the thief on the cross.

    does the text say he was baptized?....nope

    Does the text say he worked real hard at keeping the commandments?...nope

    Does the text show us that he believed in the Kingdom of Jesus ?.....yes


    Does this show us he had faith in the resurrection of Jesus?....yes



    Was this "faith" all that Christ required to save him>?........yes







    why?


    for we are save by grace though faith, and not by works...

  13. #13
    alanmolstad
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    you have to remember, "What was the underlying reason for the law/"

    Its not to make is "Better people" by the way....






    The CULTS seem to teach that people become Christians so that they can keep the law...


    thats error.


    Cults seem to think that the reason to have faith in Jesus is that this allows you some type of advantage in keeping the commandments?....this also is a wrong.

  14. #14
    alanmolstad
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    the CULTs teach that "Man was made to keep the Law"


    But this is wrong

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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    So--you believe they were saved prior to the remission of sins?

    Acts 2:38---King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.

    NOPE. I believe they were saved BEFORE THEY WERE BAPTIZED
    FOR THEY HAD BEEN SAVED. BEFORE they received FAITH (which SAVED THEM) they had NO REASON to repent OR to be baptized. BEFORE they received FAITH and WERE SAVED BY THAT FAITH (EPH 2:8-9) they were DEAD IN THEIR SINS and had NO REASON TO REPENT OR BE BAPTIZED. The UNSAVED have no desire to do either.

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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    Please feel free to show us any translation which uses "because of" in Acts2:38:

    Acts 2:38---King James Version (KJV)
    38 Then Peter said unto them, Repent, and be baptized every one of you in the name of Jesus Christ for the remission of sins, and ye shall receive the gift of the Holy Ghost.



    In the Christian Bible--one is saved by God;s grace.

    So--what is there about repentance and water baptism you don't consider a work-and what is there about the remission of sins you don't consider God's grace?

    Acts2:38--God's grace for our obedience to His work.

    Acts 2:38 God's Grace for what JESUS CHRIST did on the Cross, NOT for what YOU, as a dead, unregenerate sinner, have to offer. What YOU HAVE TO OFFER is nothing more than FILTHY RAGS to God. A dead unregenerate sinner has NOTHING HOLY TO OFFER IN SACRIFICE.

    ALL CHRISTIANS (THOSE FOLKS LIKE ME WHO HAVE BEEN SAVED) DO REPENT AND DO GET BAPTIZED.

    Your cult has nothing to offer. Just more dirt like the rest of joe smith's made-up stuff.

  17. #17
    alanmolstad
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    Does a person have to be baptized to be saved?



  18. #18
    alanmolstad
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    Default "All CULTS are "works" orientated"

    all CULTS are works orientated,



    another short video that gives us the answer to the CULTS...




  19. #19
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    the moment a person becomes saved is when they turn to the Lord and believe.
    Matthew 10:22---King James Version (KJV)
    22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.

  20. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by dberrie2000 View Post
    Matthew 10:22---King James Version (KJV)
    22 And ye shall be hated of all men for my name's sake: but he that endureth to the end shall be saved.
    Hello DB,

    We who are saved will endure to the end because we are saved and it is God who keeps us.
    Jude makes that clear.

    "Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling,
    And to present you faultless
    Before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy,
    To God our Savior,
    Who alone is wise,
    Be glory and majesty,
    Dominion and power,
    Both now and forever.
    Amen."

  21. #21
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by disciple View Post
    Hello DB, We who are saved will endure to the end because we are saved and it is God who keeps us.
    Jude makes that clear.

    "Now to Him who is able to keep you from stumbling,
    And to present you faultless
    Before the presence of His glory with exceeding joy,
    To God our Savior,
    Who alone is wise,
    Be glory and majesty,
    Dominion and power,
    Both now and forever.
    Amen."
    Hi Disciple:

    Hebrews 6:4-8--King James Version (KJV)
    4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
    5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
    6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.
    7 For the earth which drinketh in the rain that cometh oft upon it, and bringeth forth herbs meet for them by whom it is dressed, receiveth blessing from God:
    8 But that which beareth thorns and briers is rejected, and is nigh unto cursing; whose end is to be burned.

    2 Peter 2:20-22---King James Version (KJV)
    20 For if after they have escaped the pollutions of the world through the knowledge of the Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ, they are again entangled therein, and overcome, the latter end is worse with them than the beginning.
    21 For it had been better for them not to have known the way of righteousness, than, after they have known it, to turn from the holy commandment delivered unto them.
    22 But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

    Disciple--could you explain why the very servants were cast off?

    Matthew 25:14-30---King James Version (KJV)
    14 For the kingdom of heaven is as a man travelling into a far country, who called his own servants, and delivered unto them his goods.
    15 And unto one he gave five talents, to another two, and to another one; to every man according to his several ability; and straightway took his journey.
    16 Then he that had received the five talents went and traded with the same, and made them other five talents.
    17 And likewise he that had received two, he also gained other two.
    18 But he that had received one went and digged in the earth, and hid his lord's money.
    19 After a long time the lord of those servants cometh, and reckoneth with them.
    20 And so he that had received five talents came and brought other five talents, saying, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me five talents: behold, I have gained beside them five talents more.
    21 His lord said unto him, Well done, thou good and faithful servant: thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
    22 He also that had received two talents came and said, Lord, thou deliveredst unto me two talents: behold, I have gained two other talents beside them.
    23 His lord said unto him, Well done, good and faithful servant; thou hast been faithful over a few things, I will make thee ruler over many things: enter thou into the joy of thy lord.
    24 Then he which had received the one talent came and said, Lord, I knew thee that thou art an hard man, reaping where thou hast not sown, and gathering where thou hast not strawed:
    25 And I was afraid, and went and hid thy talent in the earth: lo, there thou hast that is thine.
    26 His lord answered and said unto him, Thou wicked and slothful servant, thou knewest that I reap where I sowed not, and gather where I have not strawed:
    27 Thou oughtest therefore to have put my money to the exchangers, and then at my coming I should have received mine own with usury.
    28 Take therefore the talent from him, and give it unto him which hath ten talents.
    29 For unto every one that hath shall be given, and he shall have abundance: but from him that hath not shall be taken away even that which he hath.
    30 And cast ye the unprofitable servant into outer darkness: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth.

  22. #22
    alanmolstad
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    good stuff stars around the :50 seconds part...

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    Default Nobody has an honest re****al.

    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post

    NOPE. I believe they were saved BEFORE THEY WERE BAPTIZED
    FOR THEY HAD BEEN SAVED. BEFORE they received FAITH (which SAVED THEM) they had NO REASON to repent OR to be baptized. BEFORE they received FAITH and WERE SAVED BY THAT FAITH (EPH 2:8-9) they were DEAD IN THEIR SINS and had NO REASON TO REPENT OR BE BAPTIZED. The UNSAVED have no desire to do either.


    No attempt at 're****ing' the above statement, huh? No HONEST re****al to give. At least there is no cowardly 'term-switching' or 'obfuscating' response. THAT'S good.

  24. #24
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    the moment a person becomes saved is when they turn to the Lord and believe.

    This moment can happen at many different times.

    But it's always by grace though faith, and not by works.

    Yep, it ALWAYS IS. And FAITH IS GIVEN TO US; we don't 'conjure' it up in ourselves; IT IS A GIFT FROM GOD.

  25. #25
    dberrie2000
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    NOPE. I believe they were saved BEFORE THEY WERE BAPTIZED FOR THEY HAD BEEN SAVED. BEFORE they received FAITH (which SAVED THEM)...
    In the LDS church--it's God's grace which saves.

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