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Thread: mormon salvation = 'saved' from WHAT?

  1. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post
    Mormons say the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God. So are we monotheistic or polytheistic?
    Mormons ALSO SAY that you can BECOME A GOD just as mormons ALSO SAY that others have become gods too.

    THAT MAKES MORMONS POLYTHEISTIC.

  2. #27
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    erunder posted:

    Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    No, but it DOES MEAN that Biblical Salvation is NOT 'saving' you from physical death as you claimed.
    So your claim is that the Bible denies the resurrection?

    You are being INTENTIONALLY IGNORANT. No, I am pointing out to you that SALVATION is NOT 'saving you from physical death. YOU WILL PHYSICALLY DIE, just like everyone else.

    SALVATION REMAINS reference to the FORGIVENESS OF SINS, paid for by JESUS CHRIST (the REAL ONE) on the cross, nearly 2,000 years ago.


    I believe EVERY WORD OF THE BIBLE.
    And yet you don't believe the five items I listed even though they're all Biblical.

    Yet YOU don't seem to have any 'five items' listed that I can find.
    Please list them again. . .IF THE BIBLE SAYS IT IN CONTEXT I WILL BELIEVE EVERY WORD OF IT. But of course almost always you throw verses out there OUT OF CONTEXT of what the Bible ACTUALLY SAYS.

    So REPOST your '5 items' and we will look at them.

    In the meantime, please stop playing the 'intentionally ignorant' game. It is not a game worthy of an adult imho

  3. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post


    Originally Posted by Christian [IMG]http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png[/IMG]
    Sadly you don't even realize that your 'jesus christ' is the same 'jesus christ' the muslims, white supremecists, oneness pentecostals and other cults have faith in, and NOT the REAL Jesus Christ described in the Bible.
    As monotheists, we believe there is only one Jesus Christ, so your statement is nonsensical to us.
    So you disagree with JESUS CHRIST (THE REAL ONE) Who told us:

    Matt 24:23-25
    23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
    NKJV

    IF you would look up the p***age to CHECK THE CONTEXT you would find that JESUS said it.

    So you don't believe HIM.

    We knew that. . .

    Of course you are 'monotheists in name only.' Your religion teaches you that men can be 'exalted' and BECOME GODS. How do YOU reconcile the existance of ONLY ONE GOD ANYWHERE (THE BIBLICAL GOD) with those men YOUR CULT SAYS BECAME GODS that do/don't exist?

    OY! Such a CONFUSED CULT!

  4. #29
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    Default Their false prophet lied. . .again.

    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post
    And yet I'm the one ***erting one Jesus Christ, while "Christian" is ***erting multiple Jesus Christs.


    Would that be the Father, Son, or Holy Ghost?
    JESUS (THE REAL ONE not your satanic one) said:

    Matt 24:23-25
    23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
    NKJV

    It would appear that your FALSE PROPHET told you that there are no false christs. YOUR CULT HAS LIED TO YOU. . .again

  5. #30
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    erunder posted:

    Originally Posted byalanmolstad[IMG]http://www.waltermartin.com/forums/images/****ons/viewpost-right.png[/IMG]
    Mormon teachings on the person of Jesus were invented by a conman named Smith to fool people, gain power over them, and get money, as well as the ability to sleep with their wives and at times, their daughters.
    Easy to claim; harder to prove. Anyway, I think you're just projecting a Protestant mindset onto Joseph.

    I know what you're saying is false.

    Said with head buried in sand. . .
    Last edited by Christian; 06-27-2017 at 11:02 AM.

  6. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    Mormons ALSO SAY that you can BECOME A GOD just as mormons ALSO SAY that others have become gods too.

    THAT MAKES MORMONS POLYTHEISTIC.
    Okay, so someone who believes in gods other than God is polytheistic. Would that include the gods of Psalm 82?

  7. #32
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    You are being INTENTIONALLY IGNORANT.
    False. I am asking follow-up questions based on your ignorant statements.

    No, I am pointing out to you that SALVATION is NOT 'saving you from physical death.
    And I am pointing out that you're wrong. Salvation from physical death = resurrection. And resurrection is Biblical.

    Yet YOU don't seem to have any 'five items' listed that I can find.
    The are right there in post #2. We are saved from spiritual death if we exercise faith in Christ, repent, are baptized, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, and endure to the end.

  8. #33
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    So you disagree with JESUS CHRIST (THE REAL ONE) Who told us:

    Matt 24:23-25
    23 "Then if anyone says to you, 'Look, here is the Christ!' or 'There!' do not believe it. 24 For false christs and false prophets will rise and show great signs and wonders to deceive, if possible, even the elect. 25 See, I have told you beforehand.
    NKJV
    Of course not. I disagree with you that Jesus Christ is one of these false christs.

  9. #34
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    JESUS (THE REAL ONE not your satanic one) said:
    We don't have a satanic Jesus. We disagree with you that Jesus Christ is satanic.

  10. #35
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post
    Mormons say the Father, Son, and Holy Ghost are one God. So are we monotheistic or polytheistic?
    If a person believes in more than one god, then they are NOT monotheistic.....


    so ask yourself, "Do the Mormons hold to the teaching that there are many gods?"
    If you believe the answer is "yes" then that means they are polytheistic.


    "Do the Mormons hold to the teaching that humans can become gods?"
    If you believe the answer is "yes" then that means they are polytheistic.



    It's that simple...

  11. #36
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post
    Okay, so someone who believes in gods other than God is polytheistic. Would that include the gods of Psalm 82?
    Yes, if a person believes that there is more than one God, that means they are polytheistic.

    That is also why Psalm 82 is not talking about Gods by nature, but is as I said before, a ***le given to things that have great power over others.
    In the case of Psalm 82 we are simply talking about judges that are judging in error.....

    In effect, God is mocking them.


    So Psalm 82 can not be used to support the Mormon idea that there are many Gods.





    Got anything else?

  12. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    Yes, if a person believes that there is more than one God, that means they are polytheistic.
    Okay, so if someone believes the Bible, they are polytheistic.

    That is also why Psalm 82 is not talking about Gods by nature, but is as I said before, a ***le given to things that have great power over others.
    Psalm 82 doesn't say that, and there's no exception in the definition of "polytheist" for gods who aren't gods by nature.

  13. #38
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    if you note, the psalm 82 starts out talking about the "great ***embly", and this is a known reference to the type of ruling system in place at the time.

    The text then goes on to talk about the main issue the was going wrong with these guys, when they would show - " partiality to the wicked".

    The text then goes on to encourage the same men to - "Defend the weak and the fatherless;
    uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed.
    4
    Rescue the weak and the needy;
    deliver them from the hand of the wicked."....so we are in fact talking about the rulers in charge at the time who were doing what was evil in the sight of the Lord, and who were being instructed to do good.

    Finally the fate of these men is shown at - "“I said, ‘You are “gods”;
    you are all sons of the Most High.’
    7
    But you will die like mere mortals;
    you will fall like every other ruler."

    Notice they will die just like every other "ruler"




    The text clearly teaches that these were just the rulers in power at the time....and God is mocking them and their claims of being important.





    I believe that this verses is talked about during the debate on the doorstep with a Mormon that is performed by Mr Ed Decker and Dr Walter Martin.

    Im not totally sure, but I seem to remember that recording is where Martin talks about what this verse is talking about, and if I have time I will try to review the recording and post it here so that you and anyone else interested in understanding this section of the Bible can listen to it and get up to speed.

  14. #39
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    if you note, the psalm 82 starts out talking about the "great ***embly", and this is a known reference to the type of ruling system in place at the time.

    The text then goes on to talk about the main issue the was going wrong with these guys, when they would show - " partiality to the wicked".

    The text then goes on to encourage the same men to - "Defend the weak and the fatherless;
    uphold the cause of the poor and the oppressed.
    4
    Rescue the weak and the needy;
    deliver them from the hand of the wicked."....so we are in fact talking about the rulers in charge at the time who were doing what was evil in the sight of the Lord, and who were being instructed to do good.

    Finally the fate of these men is shown at - "“I said, ‘You are “gods”;
    you are all sons of the Most High.’
    7
    But you will die like mere mortals;
    you will fall like every other ruler."

    Notice they will die just like every other "ruler"




    The text clearly teaches that these were just the rulers in power at the time....and God is mocking them and their claims of being important.





    I believe that this verses is talked about during the debate on the doorstep with a Mormon that is performed by Mr Ed Decker and Dr Walter Martin.

    Im not totally sure, but I seem to remember that recording is where Martin talks about what this verse is talking about, and if I have time I will try to review the recording and post it here so that you and anyone else interested in understanding this section of the Bible can listen to it and get up to speed.

  15. #40
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    Also check The Kingdom of the Cults page 219, Im told its relevant,,,,
    Last edited by alanmolstad; 06-28-2017 at 04:52 AM.

  16. #41
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    Quote Originally Posted by alanmolstad View Post
    Also check The Kingdom of the Cults page 219
    Due to the late hr I have not had a chance yet to review the Ed Decker/Walter martin debate to find where they deal with the Psalm verse, but I was doing a web-search and I found lots of stuff on this verse that I will be posting about later...

    Like - https://thewordonthewordoffaithinfob...and-john-1034/


    The fun part to see is justr how closely my own wordings were to the works i have seen so far...LOL-

    "Psalm 82:1 says, “God presides in the great ***embly; he gives judgment among the gods.” It is clear from the next three verses that the word “gods” refers to magistrates, judges, and other people who hold positions of authority and rule."

  17. #42
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    But to just sum up -

    There are many things and people that can be called 'god', in the context that they have great power over others.
    In the Bible some judges are called a god because they have such a powerfull control over people, power of life and death as it were.

    But they are not gods by nature, they are always human and will always be human...LOL

    Thus you can't use the Psalm 82 verse to support the crazy idea that there is more than one God ...

  18. #43
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    Default Their cult's 'slight-of-hand'

    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post
    We don't have a satanic Jesus. We disagree with you that Jesus Christ is satanic.
    Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' to your 'jesus christ,' isn't that correct?

    Doesn't that make the 'brother' of a demon, one of the same kind? Playing some 'magical' word games are you?

  19. #44
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    Default Their cult STILL lies.

    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post
    Of course not. I disagree with you that Jesus Christ is one of these false christs.

    And still, the 'jesus christ' you are talking about that you disagree about, is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' of the demon satan, right? If they are 'brothers,' are they NOT from the same 'blood line' and of the same type of being? Demons?

    Your cult STILL lies to you.

  20. #45
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' to your 'jesus christ,' isn't that correct?
    No, it isn't.

  21. #46
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    Quote Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    And still, the 'jesus christ' you are talking about that you disagree about, is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' of the demon satan, right? If they are 'brothers,' are they NOT from the same 'blood line' and of the same type of being? Demons?
    No, they're not.

  22. #47
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    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post
    No, it isn't.
    Even in the silly attempt of the Mormon church to duck around this teaching, they yet admit it's true...

    According to Mormon teaching, Satan and Jesus Christ are brothers...


    http://mormonvoices.org/1/jesus-brother-of-satan

  23. #48
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    Oh and for the record, according to Christian teaching, Jesus Christ is NOT the brother of Satan!

  24. #49
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    Default Your cult STILL lies to you.

    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post

    Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    And still, the 'jesus christ' you are talking about that you disagree about, is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' of the demon satan, right? If they are 'brothers,' are they NOT from the same 'blood line' and of the same type of being? Demons?
    No, they're not.

    No they are not from the same 'heavenly father?'
    or
    No they are not the same type of being. . .'spirit brothers?'

    Sorry but you cannot have it both ways. . .one a demon, the other a god.

    And your cult's self-contradiction shows it is a fraud.

    Your cult STILL lies to you.

  25. #50
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    Default Or did your religion lie to you yet again?

    Quote Originally Posted by Erundur View Post

    Originally Posted by Christian View Post
    Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother' to your 'jesus christ,' isn't that correct?
    No, it isn't.
    Okay, I got distracted by a telephone call from The Navy in Arlington VA and worded it incorrectly

    Yet YOUR VERSION of YOUR 'jesus christ' is supposed to be a 'spirit-brother to your 'satan,' NOW isn't that correct?

    Or did your religion lie to you yet again?

    And you continue to play little nit-picky word-games. YOU KNEW what I meant despite my typo, but you ran away from addressing it.

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