Quote Originally Posted by tdidymas View Post
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Here again, you presume that your 'gift' is of God, rather than some other source. I accept the fact that you believe that, I do not accept that your 'gift' is of the Spirit of God. In my experience, tongue-talking is largely an action of the flesh, and doesn't edify anyone. Just because you lay claim that you feel peace when you do it, doesn't prove anything one way or another. It certainly doesn't prove that you are truly edified in the faith. All your words prove to me is that you are edified in your bias that you believe your 'gift' is of God. The more you avoid answering the simple question 'how is your tongue-talking edifying other people,' the more you prove to me that your practice is fleshly, not spiritual.
Even if it were possible for me to ascend above the provisions God provides (remember?) and actually prove for you a handful of benefits (which any Christian isn’t capable in ordinary terms of producing), , what would that show of your intent? That you wanted all along to prop-up a cult-head figure to quickly dismiss? Disgusting hatred, yes you and all out of fear of the truth, Repent!

Please allow me a suggestion to you: if you want to show someone a reasonable explanation of your practice (as all the apostles did in the NT writings), then stop being mysterious about it - get out of the circular logic of "it's not explainable because it is miraculous, and therefore must be of God," and start seriously considering how to well-explain your practice from a Biblical standpoint. I'm only saying here, that if you are unwilling to do this, then why talk about it at all? If your motivation for talking about it is not to edify people with understanding, then it must be something else - maybe to get converts into your cult! Believe me when I say, if you evade a simple and key question, then it speaks volumes about what your motive is, and people generally ***ume the worst. From their view, if you are mysterious about it, look out, they suspect cultic activity.
Here we see your formula marched out again in vain. Why make faithless waves? Here you are giving out as the only one qualified to speak for the m***es with clear vision, yet incapable of citing my aversion of answering you.

1. You said "It is demonic when we begin to teach that what is said concerning these things are they themselves demonic." - firstly, I ***ume you say this because I questioned what spirit your 'gift' is from,
Absolutely not. I say this to all who holds what the Bible says about tongues is “demonic”. Get it? Do you see this slight-of-hand everyone? Don’t try and turn that into me being defensive, but a proactive statement to declare what is really going on here, the immense danger of the unpardonable “sin”. What else does one stand to profit to deceptive meanings? Of course, a movement.

2. You said, "...Egypt, where our Lord was crucified" - I take it you are using Egypt as a metaphor for Jerusalem? Then, are you not doing the same thing you accuse me of by your rhetoric? I get that your bias is equally as strong as mine in this matter. Or are you claiming that you have an open mind that your 'gift' might not be from God? I've already stated that I am open to receiving your testimony that your 'gift' is of God, I'm simply stating that I need some Biblical evidence of it which you have not yet produced (except for a biased and out-of-context interpretation typical of Pentecostal teaching). So then, if you claim that I am saying "I disagree" with a dead-sea period, it appears to me from where I am looking that you are the one saying it.
Thank you for the acknowledgment. And why not, God also established the spiritual lingo, not me and my rhetoric. (Rev. 11:8)

I do not find the scriptures deceptive. But what I do find deceptive is the Pentecostal teaching about the gift of tongues. There are certain scriptures that are taken out of context and the meaning twisted out of shape just to support the modern practice of it among Pentecostals and Charismatics. And where I am trying to show you is in the simple question "how is it edifying others." If how you are interpreting 1 Cor. 14:4 is your strongest evidence that your 'gift' is from God, then my response is "you are treading on thin ice," since I do not see that the edification that Paul is talking about in that chapter is limited to a feeling of peace (or even is a feeling of peace), since such a thing is pretextual to that p***age. Saying that experiencing peace in the practice of it might (or might not) do yourself some real good, but it does absolutely nothing for someone else's good. The argument is extremely weak. When I compare your argument with that of the apostles in the NT, it falls far short.
Your statements are rife with contempt for those who practice this, thereby the gifts themselves. Therefore, you continue to am*** a swelling thought to be for people in error when the root of your concern is to distance yourself from the gifts. This has been your narrative right along, but fear not, God knows your heart and what gifts would suit it.

Further, what was the purpose of all the flowery and vague language you originally responded with? I simply objected to it, at the time I did not accuse you of being deceptive. But if you weren't actually intending to be deceptive (to persuade me of the legitimacy of your practice), then why use flowery and vague language? Why not clearly lay out the evidence from a Biblical standpoint? Such a response only causes me to be suspicious of your practice. In fact, what it reminds me of is the cult of Simon the Sorcerer, who was called "the mighty power of God" by his followers because they figured that his mysterious ways were miraculous as opposed to deceptive. Here again, please don't ***ume that I am accusing you of it, I'm just saying what it looks like from my POV. It looks the same as the Mormon claim that they "know" the BoM is of God because they feel a "burning in the bosom" (and they invite you into their cult by saying "try it").
What’s the hurry at this point? You certainly shed some comments before arriving so verbose if that even matters.

Suspicious? That is one thing to beware. But after a season of refusing the truth, that suspicion turns into superst-i-tion fed in the carnal approach of refusing the truth. But the redundancies here exhaust life from the subject itself.

“[T]ry it”? Thanks a lot. How counter-productive, hate promoting, attack-based can one be? You keep bring up “Biblical standpoint” without being able to squelch mine. And we haven’t even begun to open them up because that is the way of the Gospel. If you don’t have any footing whatsoever on the fundamental entrance, the condition will only compound to exacerbate itself if continued.

All you seem to be able to do is attack, not correct out of the word, , ,think: II Tim 3:16.

So then, if you want some substance ("show me where") that I believe Pentecostal teaching is deceptive, here are 7 points which is not an exhaustive list:
****out! Would you mind getting to my question oh’ TDM, the one who hates evasiveness. Like of where in ch. 12 and 14? Can’t? Must continue your attack because you can’t refute the scriptures? You know, I gotta agree with you there, that would be one heckuva chore – Repent!

1. The Bible says "as the Spirit gave utterance" in which there was no teaching in the matter, no prepping, no command or coaxing or coaching for anyone to speak in tongues, they just did it "as the Spirit gave utterance." But Pentecostals and Charismatics to the contrary still teach people to speak in tongues, typically saying things like "speak, but not in English" and have taught so from the beginning of the movement in the early 20th century. In fact, some have taught how to talk tongues in a "priming the pump" fashion of parroting someone else's gibberish, to the extent that it actually became a joke among Charismatics about "kick starting" tongues with phrases like "retie my bowtie" and "sella my honda," which indicates the spiritual nonsense of people who prey on the ignorance of the untaught and unlearned.
Honestly now, keeping the two areas of tongues separate which you do seem to want to combine when convenient, I still prefer Paul’s method as I mentioned and you refuse. God is able.

2. Self-edification as a result of tongue-talking is cited as one of the strongest evidences that the practice is of God; but such edification is never explained in the context of serving others, which is the main thrust of Paul's instruction in 1 Cor. 12-14.
The deception of meaning here is astounding because of your incessant demand not to prove the gift is real, but to prove your intent to trample faith underfoot. “Never explained”? Do you not know the ends of God provision by faith which is required to be blessed in it (Col 1:27, Rm 9:23)?

At the very least, such self-edification is self-centered and self-focused. It appears to serve only the self. Any edification in the churches appears to be limited to supporting one's belief in the practice of tongues, as opposed to real edification in the faith once delivered to the saints.
People who need an extra-Biblical explanation to frame their independent goal needs to repent and recognize the truth as it has been written for all. The attempt here to distort that truth tells everyone what this charade is all about – suppression of the Spirit’s work.