Was Joseph Smith a known *****monger?

[alanmolstad]

QUESTION : Was Joseph Smith a known *****-monger?

ANSWER:.........Not that I can find.



I have looked at a lot of websites over the last few days, doing research on the question of Did Joe Smith pay girls for sex?

I found plenty of evidence that people have all kinds of reasons to think of him as a pervert and a sexually-obsessed person...

But the truth is, that Smith seems the type who never wanted to spend his own money for squat.
He was all into getting others to "GIVE" him stuff....but I don't see where he had ever tried to use cash to bed down with a girl.

Truthfully, I think Smith came up with all his religiousness and Golden Plates so he had reasons why a girl would submit to him sexually,
but I dont see where he ever promised to pay hard cash for them.


Smith would tell a young girl that if she allowed him to do her, that in return her family would receive blessings in heaven...

But I dont believe any of them ever earned a dime off of him.

[alanmolstad]

Now this is not to say that Joe Smith was not a very despicable person...clearly he was.

In looking at the record of the women he seemed constantly trying to bed, I have to wonder why people didn't try to shoot the horny guy in the face a lot sooner than they did?

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

Now this is not to say that Joe Smith was not a very despicable person...clearly he was.

In looking at the record of the women he seemed constantly trying to bed, I have to wonder why people didn't try to shoot the horny guy in the face a lot sooner than they did?

Ohmyword...I'm back to thinking you're just pure entertainment. I say one thing about you baiting (which you clearly are) ....and you do it EVEN MORE!! Like a 12 year old. Hahahahahaha....awwww man. You, Alan...are a master, well...baiter. Oh my, that explains so much.

[alanmolstad]

Now,when you go GOOGLE search for the words "Mormon Smith ***** monger" you get a lot of links to checkout.

Thats what I have done over the last few days while researching this topic.
It is true, there are a lot of sites that use the word "*****-monger"to describe Joe Smith's history of bedding down with about every gal he could seduce, but if you define the term "*****-monger"to describe a person who seeks out the services of a pros***ute, then so far I have yet to find any real accounts of someone saying that Smith ever did that.


However, in my search, I did run into one blog, written by a nice Mormon girl, who has a style of writing that showed at a very personal level, what it is like remaining a good Mormon believer, yet also understand that Smith was a very, very flawed person, and that many of the things Non-Mormons say about him he actually was guilty of.


In other words, she has found a way to remain a Mormon, in spite of the knowledge that Smith likely made-up most if not all of his testimony.

I will post the link so you can check out and see just how a Mormon girl has come to terms with the fact that Smith was flawed and likely made up stuff, and yet this does not matter to her and she is able to still remain a Mormon.
I will be going over a few things she has written and point out my own point of view as I read her's


https://askmormongirl.wordpress.com/...-joseph-smith/

[alanmolstad]

The Mormon Blog:
In the following we see something I had not known before...

" Growing up LDS, most of us learn a very simple and idealized version of the Joseph Smith story from our Sunday School and seminary teachers.
This version does us no favors when we discover—often quite accidentally, on the internet, all alone in the dark of night, or on the spot, in the company of strangers—that history was indeed more complicated. "


What was interesting is that the "idealized"and cleaned-up version of Smith was not just something taught to little kids in Sunday School, (We all can understand doing that part)....But this false image of Smith was taught later to adults by "seminary teachers"???

So they were telling lies and leaving unprepared for the real truth to the very people who were to lead the charge and take the message of Mormonism to the world.

[alanmolstad]

" Growing up LDS, most of us learn a very simple and idealized version of the Joseph Smith story from our Sunday School and seminary teachers. This version does us no favors when we discover—often quite accidentally, on the internet, all alone in the dark of night, or on the spot, in the company of strangers—that history was indeed more complicated. "


The next thing I learn is that the Mormon girl is showing us howthe false image of Smith taught to her was no favor, for in this age of the internet you cant keep people from finding out the truth.

She talks about Mormons like herself are able to "discover"the truth on their own.

She lists how this happens, "on the internet, all alone in the dark of night"

This might be talking about websites like our own Walter Martin Ministries Forum where we know Mormons from all over the world visit here each day to review past topics ,follow conversations, and slip P.M. questions to us about information they have not heard about until now, all in secret.



The Mormon girl next writes-
" or on the spot, in the company of strangers"

This reminds me of a past lady Mormon guest we used to see posting here all the time.
She would always get into arguments with Jim and Billy.
Back and forth they would argue about the past sexual history of Smith.

The Mormon lady always defended the church teaching that Smith only had one wife.
The Mormon lady always would remark that all the stories about Smith having other wives and even marring underage little girls were all lies made up by Anti-Mormons"

Then one day, the Mormon church changed it's tune.

The Mormon church came out and admitted what many Mormons had been learning on their own on the internet, that Smith had a tons of other wives and his sexual escapades with even married women were many.

The result was that I only saw the Mormon lady back here one or two more times.

I saw her post on a different topic and was arguing a point when someone brought up the new revelation about Smith and how it went totally against all what the Mormon lady had been saying for years.

That was the last I ever saw of her.

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

Now,when you go GOOGLE search for the words "Mormon Smith ***** monger" you get a lot of links to checkout.

Thats what I have done over the last few days while researching this topic.
It is true, there are a lot of sites that use the word "*****-monger"to describe Joe Smith's history of bedding down with about every gal he could seduce, but if you define the term "*****-monger"to describe a person who seeks out the services of a pros***ute, then so far I have yet to find any real accounts of someone saying that Smith ever did that.


However, in my search, I did run into one blog, written by a nice Mormon girl, who has a style of writing that showed at a very personal level, what it is like remaining a good Mormon believer, yet also understand that Smith was a very, very flawed person, and that many of the things Non-Mormons say about him he actually was guilty of.


In other words, she has found a way to remain a Mormon, in spite of the knowledge that Smith likely made-up most if not all of his testimony.

I will post the link so you can check out and see just how a Mormon girl has come to terms with the fact that Smith was flawed and likely made up stuff, and yet this does not matter to her and she is able to still remain a Mormon.
I will be going over a few things she has written and point out my own point of view as I read her's


https://askmormongirl.wordpress.com/...-joseph-smith/

More opinion by someone who doesn't believe Joseph Smith was a prophet of God. Someone struggling with their testimony, which is sad, it really is, that's why it's important to develop your OWN testimony from what you learn, what you seek and what is revealed to you by the power of the Holy Ghost. And not rely on the testimony of your parents, leaders or teachers. I hope you're not presenting this as more "proof"

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by MickeyS

And not rely on the testimony of your parents, leaders or teachers. ....."

The Mormon lady relied on the Mormon church.

That was a mistake?

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

The Mormon lady relied on the Mormon church.

That was a mistake?

Obviously you misunderstood what I said. Do you not know what a testimony is?

Do you have faith in Jesus Christ because somebody else does, or because YOU do?

[alanmolstad]

The Mormon lady relied on the Mormon church to teach her about the Mormon founder Joe Smith,

That was a mistake?






While you may have your own answer to that question, I shall go back to the Mormon Girl Blog to see what she has to say on the question...

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

The Mormon lady relied on the Mormon church to teach her about the Mormon founder Joe Smith,

That was a mistake?






While you may have your own answer to that question, I shall go back to the Mormon Girl Blog to see what she has to say on the question...

Since when didn't the church teach about Joseph Smith and plural marriage? You act like it was a secret

https://www.lds.org/manual/foundatio...riage?lang=eng

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

The Mormon lady relied on the Mormon church to teach her about the Mormon founder Joe Smith,

That was a mistake?






While you may have your own answer to that question, I shall go back to the Mormon Girl Blog to see what she has to say on the question...

My own answer to what question? If you should have your own faith and not use somebody else's faith? Do you really not know the answer to that question? You have to look it up?

[alanmolstad]

https://askmormongirl.wordpress.com/...-joseph-smith/



Lets return to read more from the Mormon Girl Blog -


In this quotation the Mormon Girls is quoting from a message she received that represents the feelings of many Mormons like herself at times.

She quotes-
“I’ve grown up Mormon my whole life and now that I’m nearly an ‘adult’ I’ve started doing a lot of investigating about the history of my faith and more importantly, Joseph Smith.
After a lot of prayers and and contemplation, I’m facing a very awkward truth in which I’ve come to the conclusion that Joseph Smith was a false prophet.
How can I continue to live in this faith if it’s based on a liar?”


This is the rub...
The person who wrote this clearly wants to remain a Mormon, she wants to remain a Mormon believer, She likely grew up in the faith and has strong family connections to the Mormon church, but she is struggling now with the revealed truth that Smith was a liar.


Now lets look how the Mormon Girl addresses this issue of wanting to remain a Mormon yet being aware that Smith was a liar and simply made up all the Mormon teachings on his own.
Knowing that the founder of your religion simply invented his ideas on his own, how will she be able to remain a Mormon, now that she knows it's a false religion?


I quote:
I’m of the mind that people should learn complicated family stories from family, not from strangers.
We need to hear this stuff at home, in church, in seminary, and I hear that up at Church headquarters, the wheels are turning to make that possible. Which is wonderful news.

She seems to be saying that with the advent of the Internet and the way the internet is helping Mormons find out the real truth about Smith on their own, that it is time the Mormon Church itself admit the truth to its members too...
The Mormon Girl is arguing against the current situation where Mormons are taught a false image of Smith, and then sent out into the world, only to then run totally unprepared into the truth that will smack into them at the door step.....or a message forum....


She hints in the last part that she has heard that the "wheels are turning" within the Mormon leadership on the issue of admitting the truth about Smith.



What this all tells me is that the real "story"about Smith is not out there yet.
We dont know yet what shoe is next to drop?...

Right now we only know that the Church has unveiled a bit of what is still hidden about Smith.

We know now he was married to lots of women|.
we know now that he used to ask women to join him in bed when he visited the homes of friends.
We know now that he slept with married women.
We know now that the whole "We are married so God says it's ok" idea came about well after he had already begun sleeping around.
We know he was after some women, and that women talked about his skirt chasing and how they turned him down.
We know now he used to convince some girls into his bed by promising them that God would reward their whole family later in heaven.
We know now a few of the women he was after sexually were underage.
We know now that some of his so-called"wives" he went after were just little girls.


These are the shoes that have dropped already, and we are told by the Mormon Girl that the "wheels are turning" on allowing other shoes to drop soon too.

and to her this is all, " wonderful news."

[MickeyS]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

https://askmormongirl.wordpress.com/...-joseph-smith/



Lets return to read more from the Mormon Girl Blog -


In this quotation the Mormon Girls is quoting from a message she received that represents the feelings of many Mormons like herself at times.

She quotes-
“I’ve grown up Mormon my whole life and now that I’m nearly an ‘adult’ I’ve started doing a lot of investigating about the history of my faith and more importantly, Joseph Smith.
After a lot of prayers and and contemplation, I’m facing a very awkward truth in which I’ve come to the conclusion that Joseph Smith was a false prophet.
How can I continue to live in this faith if it’s based on a liar?”


This is the rub...
The person who wrote this clearly wants to remain a Mormon, she wants to remain a Mormon believer, She likely grew up in the faith and has strong family connections to the Mormon church, but she is struggling now with the revealed truth that Smith was a liar.


Now lets look how the Mormon Girl addresses this issue of wanting to remain a Mormon yet being aware that Smith was a liar and simply made up all the Mormon teachings on his own.
Knowing that the founder of your religion simply invented his ideas on his own, how will she be able to remain a Mormon, now that she knows it's a false religion?


I quote:
I’m of the mind that people should learn complicated family stories from family, not from strangers.
We need to hear this stuff at home, in church, in seminary, and I hear that up at Church headquarters, the wheels are turning to make that possible. Which is wonderful news.

She seems to be saying that with the advent of the Internet and the way the internet is helping Mormons find out the real truth about Smith on their own, that it is time the Mormon Church itself admit the truth to its members too...
The Mormon Girl is arguing against the current situation where Mormons are taught a false image of Smith, and then sent out into the world, only to then run totally unprepared into the truth that will smack into them at the door step.....or a message forum....


She hints in the last part that she has heard that the "wheels are turning" within the Mormon leadership on the issue of admitting the truth about Smith.



What this all tells me is that the real "story"about Smith is not out there yet.
We dont know yet what shoe is next to drop?...

Right now we only know that the Church has unveiled a bit of what is still hidden about Smith.

We know now he was married to lots of women|.
we know now that he used to ask women to join him in bed when he visited the homes of friends.
We know now that he slept with married women.
We know now that the whole "We are married so God says it's ok" idea came about well after he had already begun sleeping around.
We know he was after some women, and that women talked about his skirt chasing and how they turned him down.
We know now he used to convince some girls into his bed by promising them that God would reward their whole family later in heaven.
We know now a few of the women he was after sexually were underage.
We know now that some of his so-called"wives" he went after were just little girls.


These are the shoes that have dropped already, and we are told by the Mormon Girl that the "wheels are turning" on allowing other shoes to drop soon too.

and to her this is all, " wonderful news."

You are quoting a Mormon feminist. Somebody who questions everything about the way the church is run because of what they see as "fair". They think the role of wife and mother that God bestowed upon us women as condescending and degrading, so they seek for "equality" in the church. God did not make us equal, He made us DIFFERENT. But they are allowing society and world views shape what THEY think needs to happen. They make demands that leaders change actual doctrine where it comes to the priesthood. In short, they don't truly have a testimony of the gospel of Jesus Christ as it has been revealed to man in these latter days. She doesn't believe in the church...not really.

Now all those things you "know" - you really don't...you don't KNOW anything..

Let me tell YOU a story

Three years ago there was a terrible shooting at a Connecticut elementary school that left 20 young children and 6 adults dead. That community was rocked by the horror, but it was also felt in my hometown as well because the family of one of the little girls is from where I grew up, and where the rest of my family still lives. My mother attended high school with both the paternal & maternal grandmothers to this little girl. She told me how devastated this family was.

Now, over the last year I have been made aware of a movement of people who not only believe this tragedy was a hoax engineered by the government, they believe these families are actors and their children NEVER EXISTED, let alone died. There are A LOT of people who are being sucked into this hysteria simply because of information they have found on the Internet, most of which comes from "reputable" "intelligent" individuals, some even have PHD's, and they have painstakingly compiled "evidence" that if taken at face value (without investigating) will actually appear to support everything these people say. That coupled with the fact that SO MANY people believe this, is making this become "history" and "fact". My mom had a conversation a couple of months ago with one of those grandmothers, and these conspiracy theorists have made their life HELL on top of the grieving that never seems to end, when people are har***ing you that your child never existed in the first place.

The ACTUAL facts are these children are dead and good people are being vilified, all because people who don't trust the government are seeking negative information about these events without actually investigating said information or the sources. They only believe it because it supports their already negative view, and it must be true if so many people say so. The thing is, especially with the Internet, if you go seeking to "prove" a belief you already have, you will absolutely find that "proof". No matter what it is. Does it mean it's actually true....well of course not....but can you convince these people....never, because their minds are made up. All you seek Alan is negative information that you ONLY agree with because it supports your views. You don't even research the information, the sources or anything that refutes it.

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by alanmolstad

[..... we are told by the Mormon Girl that the "wheels are turning" on allowing other shoes to drop soon too.

and to her this is all, " wonderful news."

Now the Mormon Girls lists for us the things she puts forward as things that are part of the "Wheels are turning" that the Mormon leadership is planning to bring out in more welcome detail.

I quote:
"as to the human side of Joseph Smith. . .

polygamous relationships with women and girls as young as Fanny Alger, who was, historians believe, fifteen or sixteen when Joseph Smith initiated a relationship with her, without the knowledge of his wife Emma.

... Borrowings from Anglo-American folk magic and Masonic rites.

Questions about the creation of the Book of Mormon and its literal historicity."



wheels are turning.......wheels are turning....

[alanmolstad]

Based on some information I learned this winter I now know Smith did offer one young girl $5 bucks for sex.