Trinity Question

[johnd]

Originally Posted by jade84116

The Athanasian Creed rules out "dividing the substance" so, you cannot argue "one person in the Godhead created" without denying the Trinity.

Excuse please. No creed takes authority over holy scripture.

And it affirms the Triune nature of the Trinity that individuals within can and have done things the other two have not.

[jade84116]

Originally Posted by johnd

No creed takes authority over holy scripture.

Agreed. However, even you have to admit that as a practical matter trinitarians give those creeds equal status with the scripture while denying that they do. This being a spill over from Catholicism's putting tradition, creeds, and the church over scripture. If you were truly honest, then, you'd have to admit that I'm right on this one point.

[johnd]

I am truly honest, but your point is only that those trinitarians who don't know the bibhlical evidence for the triune nature of God use creeds as a crutch. So what? It doesn't change the fact that the Bible teaches that God is a unity of plural individuals who have within unison individual thought and individual will and individual personality and personhood.

Jesus said I and the Father are one. He did not say I am the Father. He did not say I and the Father are one and the same. He said two persons (I, 1, and the Father, 2) are one in mindset, one in purpose, of a kind.

Both Father and Son sent the Holy Spirit into the world. One cannot send one's self. One comes or goes, but being sent is from another source / person. And the Holy Spirit is just as much a person as the Father or the Son...

Acts 13:2 While they were worshiping the Lord and fasting, the Holy Spirit said, “Set apart for me Barnabas and Saul for the work to which I have called them.”

Just trying to cover all the usual bases here.

If you were truly honest, you'd have to admit something extrabiblical is keeping ypu from believing the trinitarian theology in the Bible right before your eyes.

[jade84116]

Originally Posted by johnd

If you were truly honest, you'd have to admit something extrabiblical is keeping ypu from believing the trinitarian theology in the Bible right before your eyes.

History tells us that the Jews of Old and New Testament times were absolute monotheists not trinitarians. Most Bible scholars maintain that. Historical context isn't extrabiblical! In any event, I'm done with this thread. Arguing over such on this type of forum should probably not be done and I'm putting an end to things at this point.

[Trinity]

Originally Posted by jade84116

History tells us that the Jews of Old and New Testament times were absolute monotheists not trinitarians. Most Bible scholars maintain that. Historical context isn't extrabiblical! In any event, I'm done with this thread. Arguing over such on this type of forum should probably not be done and I'm putting an end to things at this point.

Never let the frustration to take the best of you, and tell yourself, thus possibly at this moment of my life there are things that I am ignoring the existence.

Isaiah, 40, 18
To whom then will ye liken God? Or what likeness will ye compare unto him?

Shall I say: Creator, Sustainer, Pardoner, Near One, Distant One, Incomprehensible One, God both of flowers and stars, God of the gentle wind and of terrible battles, Wisdom, Power, Loyalty and Truthfulness, Eternity and Infinity, you the All-Merciful, you the Just One, you Love itself?
Karl Rahner, Prayers for Meditation (1968)

All believers on earth can not understand the deep nature of God. He is the great mystery.

Trinity

[johnd]

Originally Posted by jade84116

History tells us that the Jews of Old and New Testament times were absolute monotheists not trinitarians. Most Bible scholars maintain that. Historical context isn't extrabiblical! In any event, I'm done with this thread. Arguing over such on this type of forum should probably not be done and I'm putting an end to things at this point.

As I said... you must resort to the extrabiblical (i.e. historic accounts) to deny what is in scripture. History does not lead one to salvation. The Bible does.

[johnd]

Jade apparently is running for cover because the doctrine of the Trinity has people here who are not unread on the subject as many (dare I say most) Christians are.

Trinitarian theology is not so hard to fathom or comprehend when one uses the correct mathematical formula for the compound unity of three individuals who are the one God. We understand the formula very well in another compound unity (the family unit). How hard is that to understand?

When one of the individuals of the Godhead speaks as an individual, he is speaking for the Godhead itself. "I am the Senate..." that sort of thing. So not to be confused by this manner of speaking or the persistent tendency of folks to equate one God per person or one person per God, the triune nature of God is as easy to understand as a family unit is, or the three spatial dimensions are.

And the willingness or lack thereof to be open to the truth about such matters is common in how Jade ran for cover. I've seen JW's and Mormons do it at my door and where I met them on the streets... its a form of self deification (wanting to decide how God should be and denying evidence to the contrary).

We should all learn these things in the Body Christian.

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by jade84116

History tells us that the Jews of Old and New Testament times were absolute monotheists not trinitarians.

The Trinity is One God...not 3 gods...

Thus the people that believe in the trinity 9all Christians0 still believe in the one God of the jews...

[alanmolstad]

Originally Posted by jade84116

History tells us that the Jews of Old and New Testament times were absolute monotheists not trinitarians.

The Trinity is One God...not 3 gods...

Thus the people that believe in the trinity (all Christians) still believe in the one God of the jews...