End Times--Mormon style

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by Billyray

I don't think I ever heard that when I was LDS. That is interesting. But I wonder how the events and times matches up, I don't see how this would work.

Then you never read the D&C.

Marvin

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

Then you never read the D&C.

Marvin

What section talks about the seven seals of revelation and how this applies to before the foundation of the earth through the second coming? Is that what you believe Marvin?

[Russianwolfe]

Originally Posted by Billyray

What section talks about the seven seals of revelation and how this applies to before the foundation of the earth through the second coming? Is that what you believe Marvin?

You are the one whom claims to have been LDS. And then you make it known that you have never heard that the seals represent a thousand yearsnofnthe earth's history. Another gap in the truth of who you really are.

Marvin

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

You are the one whom claims to have been LDS. And then you make it known that you have never heard that the seals represent a thousand yearsnofnthe earth's history. Another gap in the truth of who you really are.

Marvin

I was simply being honest with you Marvin-- over the many years in the church I never recall this being discussed once in Sacrament meeting, nor in Sunday School, nor in seminary.

D and C 77:7

Q. What are we to understand by the seven seals with which it was sealed?
A. We are to understand that the first seal contains the things of the bfirst thousand years, and the csecond also of the second thousand years, and so on until the seventh.


Marvin perhaps you can explain how each seal lines up with each thousand year period because I can't see how this would work at all. To me this is quite odd.

[Billyray]

Revelation 6
The Seals
*I watched as the Lamb opened the first of the seven seals. Then I heard one of the four living creatures say in a voice like thunder, “Come!” 2*I looked, and there before me was a white horse! Its rider held a bow, and he was given a crown, and he rode out as a conqueror bent on conquest.


So the guy on the white horse is Christ according to BigJ. And this first seal relates for 1000 years starting with Adam. Can you explain what Christ did during this thousand year period and then what happened to him after the thousand years was up?

[James Banta]

Originally Posted by Russianwolfe

You are the one whom claims to have been LDS. And then you make it known that you have never heard that the seals represent a thousand yearsnofnthe earth's history. Another gap in the truth of who you really are.

Marvin

That is the same thing you have said about me as I have said that mormonism doesn't hold to the Bible.. When I explained Bible truth you have said I don't know mormonism.. When I have examined mormon doctrines in the light of the Bible you are convinced that I don't know what I am talking about and was never LDS. Now here you are again accusing Billy of that because he wasn't taught one false LDS teaching.. I would say that maybe 60 of 70% of LDS people know anything of this doctrine.. You have yo be VERY well studied to know about this rather fringe teaching.. If a Christian reads revelation it is clear that these are end time occurrences. As an example:

Rev 6:7-8
And when he had opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth beast say, Come and see.
And I looked, and behold a pale horse: and his name that sat on him was Death, and Hell followed with him. And power was given unto them over the fourth part of the earth, to kill with sword, and with hunger, and with death, and with the beasts of the earth.

Can you look into history and show me what era this happened in? One thousand years period where a fourth part of the earth, was killed with sword, with hunger, and by the beasts of the earth? I have never heard of such a era.. According to LDS interpretation that would have been 4,000 years after Adam. I don't remember a quarter of the whole population of the world dying in such a way in any time from Noah through Babylonian captivity. If you are to teach that as truth point to each seals historic reference. I know why you don't.. IT CAN'T BE DONE! This interpretation of the scripture is like most of LDS interpretations it is of men and not of GOD.. IHS jim

[BigJulie]

Originally Posted by Billyray

Revelation 6
The Seals
*I watched as the Lamb opened the first of the seven seals. Then I heard one of the four living creatures say in a voice like thunder, “Come!” 2*I looked, and there before me was a white horse! Its rider held a bow, and he was given a crown, and he rode out as a conqueror bent on conquest.


So the guy on the white horse is Christ according to BigJ. And this first seal relates for 1000 years starting with Adam. Can you explain what Christ did during this thousand year period and then what happened to him after the thousand years was up?

Without Christ, there would be no Adam. With the birth of Adam, death, famine, war, all came into the world. And Christ will conquer and overcome them all.

Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

In both Revelations 6 and 19, it speaks of a rider on a white horse--one who holds a bow and a crown and Rev 6:2 "went forth conquering, and to conquer" and in 19, he does judge and make war. I see this as discussing the same thing.

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

Without Christ, there would be no Adam. With the birth of Adam, death, famine, war, all came into the world. And Christ will conquer and overcome them all.

Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

In both Revelations 6 and 19, it speaks of a rider on a white horse--one who holds a bow and a crown and Rev 6:2 "went forth conquering, and to conquer" and in 19, he does judge and make war. I see this as discussing the same thing.

it will be a white M1 army tank.
each generations has a new twist on the end of the world, and this generation has dec 21,2012, and when that dates p*** there will be a new one

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

Without Christ, there would be no Adam. With the birth of Adam, death, famine, war, all came into the world. And Christ will conquer and overcome them all.

Rev 19:11 And I saw heaven opened, and behold a white horse; and he that sat upon him [was] called Faithful and True, and in righteousness he doth judge and make war.

In both Revelations 6 and 19, it speaks of a rider on a white horse--one who holds a bow and a crown and Rev 6:2 "went forth conquering, and to conquer" and in 19, he does judge and make war. I see this as discussing the same thing.

So you have Christ come on the scene for a thousand years starting with Adam and conquers. What does Christ conquer? And where does he go after the thousand years is up?

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

each generations has a new twist on the end of the world, and this generation has dec 21,2012, and when that dates p*** there will be a new one

I don't know of any Christians whou have come up with this date rather this is a Mayan calander contrivance.

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by Billyray

I don't know of any Christians whou have come up with this date rather this is a Mayan calander contrivance.

It's not only the Mayan's who had a date many groups and persons of faith and none faith had dates in the past. I think the Jehovah witness had the last date in 1975, and then there was the peacher who had a date come and go and then he gave another date back in October that came and went.
I am still waiting on Joseph Smith jr. date to come, are we still in the 1800s?

[BigJulie]

Originally Posted by Billyray

So you have Christ come on the scene for a thousand years starting with Adam and conquers. What does Christ conquer? And where does he go after the thousand years is up?

No, Adam is the prophet of the first 1000 years (figuratively). Christ is there throughout all the seals---but the beginning, begins with Christ. Is there anything to say that the horses disappear once let loose?

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

No, Adam is the prophet of the first 1000 years (figuratively). Christ is there throughout all the seals---but the beginning, begins with Christ. Is there anything to say that the horses disappear once let loose?

Revelation 6
The Seals
*I watched as the Lamb opened the first of the seven seals. Then I heard one of the four living creatures say in a voice like thunder, “Come!” 2*I looked, and there before me was a white horse! Its rider held a bow, and he was given a crown, and he rode out as a conqueror bent on conquest.

D and C 77:7

Q. What are we to understand by the seven seals with which it was sealed?
A. We are to understand that the first seal contains the things of the bfirst thousand years, and the csecond also of the second thousand years, and so on until the seventh.

So the guy on the white horse is Adam?

[BigJulie]

Originally Posted by Billyray

So the guy on the white horse is Adam?

No, each seal represents 1000 years. The one on the white horse---as far as I read it--is Christ. You are making the mistake of thinking the horse is the seal or the rider is the seal, but they just come out when the seal opens. And the horse and the rider, once let loose remains. You don't think that war and death and Christ's victory only exists during the tribulation, right?

For example, the second seal---taking peace from the earth---are you stating that this will only happen during the tribulation? What about right now? Do you think there is peace throughout the earth?

BTW, Billyray, your lack of knowledge of the D&C until now goes to prove the point that regardless of your claims of being a missionary---you don't know our scriptures or our beliefs.

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

No, each seal represents 1000 years.

Right. Which is what D and C 77 says.

Originally Posted by BigJulie

The one on the white horse---as far as I read it--is Christ.

Which you have said in the past. But then you said in a prior post that "No, Adam is the prophet of the first 1000 years (figuratively)." So I thought that you changed it from Christ to Adam.

Originally Posted by BigJulie

You are making the mistake of thinking the horse is the seal or the rider is the seal, but they just come out when the seal opens.

So Christ comes out during the time of Adam.

Originally Posted by BigJulie

And the horse and the rider, once let loose remains.

But this violates the one thousand year time from as noted in D and C 77 which says: "We are to understand that the first seal contains the things of the first thousand years"

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

BTW, Billyray, your lack of knowledge of the D&C until now goes to prove the point that regardless of your claims of being a missionary---you don't know our scriptures or our beliefs.

I don't think I am alone on not really knowing about this specific teaching in the D and C. You seem to be having a difficult time with it yourself.

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

No, each seal represents 1000 years. The one on the white horse---as far as I read it--is Christ. You are making the mistake of thinking the horse is the seal or the rider is the seal, but they just come out when the seal opens. And the horse and the rider, once let loose remains. You don't think that war and death and Christ's victory only exists during the tribulation, right?

For example, the second seal---taking peace from the earth---are you stating that this will only happen during the tribulation? What about right now? Do you think there is peace throughout the earth?

BTW, Billyray, your lack of knowledge of the D&C until now goes to prove the point that regardless of your claims of being a missionary---you don't know our scriptures or our beliefs.

No one understands it all, I would go further and say, no one as to this date understands 99% of Revelation. So many have failed in the past even your prophet Joseph Smith jr failed with his end of the world prophecy.

[BigJulie]

Originally Posted by Billyray

I don't think I am alone on not really knowing about this specific teaching in the D and C. You seem to be having a difficult time with it yourself.

Not at all. You want the seals to be a nice little package that opens and shuts, rather than an opening, a representation of the opening, and what occurs from that point forward.

And I am amazed you think that we must have the tribulation before death, war, famine, etc come to the earth. You should know better just be reading the news.

[BigJulie]

Originally Posted by RealFakeHair

No one understands it all, I would go further and say, no one as to this date understands 99% of Revelation. So many have failed in the past even your prophet Joseph Smith jr failed with his end of the world prophecy.

I don't think so---I think he understood it.

[RealFakeHair]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

I don't think so---I think he understood it.

I don't see how anyone could remain mormon and believe otherwise.
Joseph Smith jr. as a false prophet is # 1098 of the many reasons why I find him to be Fraud. I hope you don't asks me to list them all

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

Not at all. You want the seals to be a nice little package that opens and shuts, rather than an opening, a representation of the opening, and what occurs from that point forward.

Actually I just want you to explain it to me and thus far you seem to be having some difficutly. But that aside D and C 77 says "We are to understand that the first seal contains the things of the first thousand years"

Start from scratch if you need to and tell me about the first seal, who is the rider--which I ***ume you will still say Christ-- and what exactly does Christ do in this first thousand years, and where does Christ go after the thousand years since according to D and C all of that seal in contained in the first thousand years.

[Billyray]

Originally Posted by BigJulie

And I am amazed you think that we must have the tribulation before death, war, famine, etc come to the earth. You should know better just be reading the news.

Your statement shows that you are completely unaware of my beliefs. But this thread is not about what I believe but about what you believe.

[Billyray]

Jim brought this up already but I will repeat it.

Rev 6:7 When the Lamb opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say, “Come!” 8 I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.


Did 1/4 of the people on the earth get killed during the 3000-4000 year time frame after Adam?

[Billyray]

Thus far we have for LDS end times thinking that it will get really bad then Christ comes back. Okay fair enough. It that it or is there more that you are not telling me?

Below are several endtime events that some (but not all) Christians believe will take place prior to the second coming of Christ. Can you tell me if you believe in any or all of the following and how would you order them as occuring per LDS thinking?

1. Wars and rumors of wars
2. Rapture
3. Antichrist
4. Antichrist desecrates the rebuilt Jewish temple
5. Two witnesses (prophets) who teach around Jerusalem
6. Battle of Armegeddon
7. Second comimg of Christ

[BigJulie]

Originally Posted by Billyray

Jim brought this up already but I will repeat it.

Rev 6:7 When the Lamb opened the fourth seal, I heard the voice of the fourth living creature say, “Come!” 8 I looked, and there before me was a pale horse! Its rider was named Death, and Hades was following close behind him. They were given power over a fourth of the earth to kill by sword, famine and plague, and by the wild beasts of the earth.


Did 1/4 of the people on the earth get killed during the 3000-4000 year time frame after Adam?

Once again, you are making the mistake that what is opened in the seal happens only within the seal rather than it being another dispensation opened.