Quote Originally Posted by Saxon View Post
You are still barking up the wrong tree. The scripture is totally clear that Jesus will lose none that the Father has given him. Jesus losing the saved is not the problem. The problem is made clear in Hebrews 3:12. The problem is Christians departing from the living God. The longer you keep looking at what God has already said won’t happen the less likely you will come to realize what the problem actually is.

Hebrews 3:12 Take heed, brethren, lest there be in any of you an evil heart of unbelief, in departing from the living God.





When a person is a believer they do not want to lose their salvation. There is a devil that is out there trying to deceive and deceiving those that believe. It is the lost that are already deceived but the saved are the targets for deception. (See Deuteronomy 11:16, Luke 21:8, and 2 Timothy 3:13) If it were not possible for the saved to be deceived, then why the warnings to Christians to be not deceived? 1 Peter 5:8 warns us that the devil is out to devour anyone that he can. The lost are already devoured.

The Christians that are the saved at the first resurrection did persevere to the end but there those that started off but did not persevere to the end. Luke 8:13 states this clearly. They received the word with joy and after a while they fall away.

When they fall away the Holy Spirit leaves them as they are not saved any longer. There is no scripture that says the Holy Spirit will stay in a person that has gone back to sin. The Holy Spirit will continue to convict that person that has fallen away but he does not dwell in sinners.

Deuteronomy 11:16 Take heed to yourselves, that your heart be not deceived, and ye turn aside, and serve other gods, and worship them;

Luke 21:8 And he said, Take heed that ye be not deceived: for many shall come in my name, saying, I am Christ; and the time draweth near: go ye not therefore after them.

2 Timothy 3:13 But evil men and seducers shall wax worse and worse, deceiving, and being deceived

1 Peter 5:8 Be sober, be vigilant; because your adversary the devil, as a roaring lion, walketh about, seeking whom he may devour:

Luke 8:13 They on the rock are they, which, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, which for a while believe, and in time of temptation fall away.
Hi Saxon and thanks for your reply.
Ok so just so I am clear, are you saying that the responsability for staying saved lies soley with the Christian? It seems you believe that God will not take salvation away nor will Jesus lose any that are given to Him, so the only other conclusion is that a Christian becomes lost again by something he does. Is this correct?